Author Topic: Optiview Non Reflective Pinball Glass  (Read 626 times)

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Offline joele

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Re: Optiview Non Reflective Pinball Glass
« Reply #15 on: February 14, 2013, 02:13:44 PM »
While we are being coy....

I spoke to a sales rep for Viridian today (the company that manufactures Optiview anti reflective glass), who gave me some very interesting info on this product.

It seems this glass isn't quite as expensive as we are being led to believe.

#@#

(More info coming after the Easter break, once I have rock solid quotes and order quantities.)  ^^^

Hi any news come of this, the only place in Australia I can find that mentioned non reflective glass was Mr Pinball, but I can't find it on the site anymore and he doesn't bother with replying to emails on the subject..
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Offline pinsanity

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Re: Optiview Non Reflective Pinball Glass
« Reply #16 on: February 14, 2013, 11:07:47 PM »
While we are being coy....

I spoke to a sales rep for Viridian today (the company that manufactures Optiview anti reflective glass), who gave me some very interesting info on this product.

It seems this glass isn't quite as expensive as we are being led to believe.

#@#

(More info coming after the Easter break, once I have rock solid quotes and order quantities.)  ^^^

Hi any news come of this, the only place in Australia I can find that mentioned non reflective glass was Mr Pinball, but I can't find it on the site anymore and he doesn't bother with replying to emails on the subject..

Yes, I bought one "test" sheet direct from the Pilkington/Viridian factory for $175 a sheet (versus MrPinballs $350, PDI's $295 and JJP's $295).  It is a sheet of glass with an anti reflective clear laminated film* on both sides. The glass has a slight bluey/greenish tinge to it (due to the film?) when looked at it through the edges but is not noticeable when looking at it "front on". The film is not visible when viewed front on. There was a lead "waiting" time of about a month from memory - I presume they wait for sufficient orders to come in and then make them in bulk batches of various glass thicknesses to save labour costs due to the manufacturing process.

*This is simplifying it a bit, as it is more than just a sheet of laminated film, the film itself is chemically baked on to eliminate reflection. Viridian has patented and trademarked the process as "Optiview". Other manufacturers have similar processes which they have patented/trademarked as explained earlier in this thread.

Honest review (rather than I spent so much on a sheet of pinball glass so I want it to be amazing &&) is that it is far better than standard glass no doubt about it, but there is still "some" level of reflection that you can see at certain angles whilst playing (the orange DMD reflection in particular at the top of the playfield glass). I tend to move around a fair bit whilst playing pins in order to keep track of the ball - standing straight up and facing the machine is virtually crystal clear and looks like there is literally no glass there at all, but once you move around a bit and look at it on a sideways angle is when some reflection starts to appear - so it is definitely not 100% effective. (They do claim it will eliminate 98% of reflection so I guess this is the 2% margin of error :tumble:).*

Personally, I think the price would need to fall below the $100 per sheet price point for me to buy more.

I have heard similar feedback regarding lack of 100% anti-reflection from credible buyers of anti-reflective glass in their respective countries. In that case I am rather glad I didn't outlay the $300 plus shipping for a sheet of glass which essentially has the same reflective properties as the one bought locally.

Offline Retropin

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Re: Optiview Non Reflective Pinball Glass
« Reply #17 on: February 15, 2013, 12:13:07 AM »
Interesting and thank you.

So its just an anti reflective laminate??

tempered PF glass  is pretty cheap... suppliers here in QLD seem to be competing for this tiny market. I bought 4 Zaccaria glasses and they gave me 5... stupid size off cut so we tempered it  and you may as well have it for free...at $16 inc GST each... the 5th free was a great suprise!

Anyway... ill talk to my suppliers and see if they have a non reflective laminate.. i can get gloss, satin, matte etc already. It wont be chemically baked on of course but i can run a sheet of glass through the laminator ( LOL- ive tried already). In fact, if i can source the laminate, it can be put on by hand if done correctly.
Might be a budget way of getting the same effect?

Ill do some enquiries and see what i can turn up.

Offline Retropin

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Re: Optiview Non Reflective Pinball Glass
« Reply #18 on: February 15, 2013, 12:17:23 AM »
??? I wonder???

Will try to get a couple of metres sample in... heres the de******ion.. will depend greatly on just how clear it is..


Self adhesive anti-scratch non reflective film with a deep finish, ideal for wall- and Floor graphics or pop-up Systems

It might just be the same material used for safety signs... cant read a safety sign with the sun glaring from it!
« Last Edit: February 15, 2013, 12:20:54 AM by Retropin »

Offline pinsanity

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Re: Optiview Non Reflective Pinball Glass
« Reply #19 on: February 15, 2013, 12:52:40 AM »
So its just an anti reflective laminate??

There's some kind of chemically hard baked outer coating on top of the laminate that is used to get it up to that 98% mark (in conjunction with the laminate). This is the part they have trademarked/patented so the sales rep was hesitant to go into details (or he simply didn't know).

From the website which is vague as well as to the coating itself:

"Pilkington OptiView™ is a laminated glass with low reflective coatings on surfaces #1 and #4 (both outer surfaces of the laminated glass), which reduces interior and exterior visible light reflectance to less than 2%. As a consequence, views from both inside and out are clear, un-obscured and virtually reflection-free."


EDIT: Adding the actual website url might help... @.@

http://www.pilkington.com/north-america/usa/english/products/bp/bybenefit/specialapplications/optiview/default.htm



I think a plain laminate film could be a very cost effective alternative depending on the transparency of the laminate of course.  ()
« Last Edit: February 15, 2013, 01:14:29 AM by pinsanity »

Offline Retropin

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Re: Optiview Non Reflective Pinball Glass
« Reply #20 on: February 15, 2013, 01:37:43 AM »
So its just an anti reflective laminate??

There's some kind of chemically hard baked outer coating on top of the laminate that is used to get it up to that 98% mark (in conjunction with the laminate). This is the part they have trademarked/patented so the sales rep was hesitant to go into details (or he simply didn't know).

From the website which is vague as well as to the coating itself:

"Pilkington OptiView™ is a laminated glass with low reflective coatings on surfaces #1 and #4 (both outer surfaces of the laminated glass), which reduces interior and exterior visible light reflectance to less than 2%. As a consequence, views from both inside and out are clear, un-obscured and virtually reflection-free."



Yes.. but when i read something that is vague i immediately assume that something simple is going on that is being charged top dollar for.

Let me explain a bit and indulge myelf..

If i had a sheet of glass and used a vinyl to make it non reflective i would want to talk it up a bit to sell as a product.
Non reflective  laminate vinyl has been around for a long time... it is used in safety signs as mandatory standard for both external and internal signs.
I can apply this laminate dry or wet... ALL laminates and vinyl are porous.. its a fact. The micron thick amount of water left behind a laminate/ vinyl can be removed by placing in the sun for a short amount of time.. it sucks out of the front.
Sometimes, when we apply dry we will then run a hair dryer over the face to " super" laminate.. it welds the vinyl to its base structure... it could be said that its a chemical lamination .. the structure of the laminate is altered to a more fluid form.. then it shrink wraps itself... its how cars are done with full prints.

The laminate i will be looking at is scratch resistant.. well thats what we want...
its also anti reflective.. again.. its what we want.
It can be heat shrinked on... chemically forming a more stable adhesion... starting to sound familiar.
YOU have some of this glass and can see bluey/ greenish tint.. this could be down to the tempered glass.. could also be the very slight discolouration that a laminate film gives.. cant see it face on, but look at the edge and you are loooking through 600mm wide of material.. completely different sight. Even glass does this.. look through at the short point ( face on) and its clear... hold it up to the edge and i can tell you whether its lead.. lead free or soda glass just by the colour it gives.

Now if i told you that i can buy a roll of quality laminate ( 90 metres as its all from USA) wholesale for a lot less than you are paying to have a sheet of glass coated and give the same effect, would you be interested?? You could apply yourself to your EXISTING PF glass.. get the same effect at a fraction of the cost.. remember, its scratch resistant and in a home environmemt.. i cant see cigarettes and beer cans on the glass.
.. OR.... you could get a whole new sheet of tempered glass... apply the laminate and save yourself a possible $100 on the price you paid.... $300 dollars on our mate Mr Pinballs price.


IF after a couple of years, it has started to not be so scratch resistant.. you simply replace at a cost 1/10th that of our mate Mr Pinballs as you only need to replace the laminate.

Sell a new glass with laminate and its a whole new product that you can up sell
Sell components and its a different ball game... OK.. we may not have a patented process.. but the effect would be the same and at a fraction of the cost.

Bet my arse i can give the same effect at a fraction of the cost.. and the plus side is that you can do it yourself several times over before you come near the prices demanded







Offline Richyrich

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Re: Optiview Non Reflective Pinball Glass
« Reply #21 on: February 15, 2013, 04:47:34 PM »
Interesting read

Thanks R

Even  at $175  its a lot better than $300-350

Did that include shipping??