The Aussie Pinball Arcade
Aussie Pinball Forums => General Chat - Non Pinball/coin-opp Discussion => Topic started by: beaky on April 30, 2010, 01:01:47 AM
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Once again the government of this country is putting the tobbaco tax up. ^.^ I thought this country had a GST that abolished other sales taxes. !@# The government recons that it will make some people to stop smoking, it will for a while but then the people who have given up take the habit up again. Or more people will buy chop chop and by pass the tax all together.
If they where serious about stopping people smoking then they would pay for the products that are used to help people quit smoking out of the tabbaco tax.
Have you seen the prices on those quit smoking products? It's cheaper to buy tobbaco then buy patches or gum. And have you ever tasted that nicotine gum? it tastes like crap. I mean they can make a potato chip taste like anything your heart desires but the nicotine gum tastes like crap. If they where really serious about making people stop smoking then they would ban the sale of tabbaco full stop. I am a smoker but you tell me when has a product ever been allowed to be sold after it has been proven that it causes cancer? (other than tobbaco)
Imagine how much money the government would loose if they banned the sale of tabbaco?
It all comes down to the government needs more money for their health and hospital overhaul, The tax increase will raise an extra $5 billion over four years, which the Government will put towards its health and hospitals overhaul.
one comment made me laugh. "All these people who are smoking legitimate tobacco are going to go to the chop-chop now. That is more harmful than smoking this - they have bugs and parasites and who knows how it's produced, so it will compound health problems in the long run"
So what they are trying to say is its healthier to smoke acitone and a whole heap of other chemicals than smoking a few bugs? Yeah right.
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They have taxed tobacco to death here in the US.
I'm not a smoker, but both my parents are. And my wife's Mom does, her Dad did, but he stopped when he had heart surgery and was told to stop by his doctors.
A carton of one brand was $50 the other day when I was waiting in line to pay for something at the corner gas station and looked up at the sign. That was one of the more expensive brands, but still, damn!
A lot of people from Indiana (my state) drive south to Kentucky a few times a year and stock up, as taxes are much lower there since Kentucky makes a large portion of the tobacco consumed in the US.
I'm not educated on the numbers, but I have heard the number of smokers has dropped.
It's also frowned upon heavily in the US society. Smoking is banned in my county with the exception of bars and 'private clubs' - and in some counties here, they've even banned it in bars!
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I have a love/hate relationship with tobacco... often quit and then go back in times of stress... at the moment im back on them.
The government will ALWAYS tax tobacco to the hilt... it pulls in large revenue for them. Once the majority of smokers have died off ( older gen of cancer suckers) and the revenue gained drops off, we will be taxed on alcohol to the hilt because it will be for our "own good".
Its true... nicorette etc is DEARER than cigarettes... whether this be because of tax or not im not sure, but yes, it costs more to quit than to continue.
It makes you laugh though... good old Gov is always working for our best interesrts.. when you obviously cant look after yourself.. good old Gov will do it for you.
Examples of "we do this cos its for your own good"
Tobacco tax
Alcohol tax
Compulsory Super ( taxed if you access it)
Electricity Hikes ( will save the planet????? Bizarre.... meanwhile we will pull more coal out of the ground to burn and sell it to China and replace all those NON power requiring speed limit signs with electric LED ones)
I could add... but im orf for a cup o tea and a fag.....
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I think its awesome that dirty smokers pay more tax, keep puffing guys!
Funding the health system via your tar soaked lungs :lol
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I could add... but im orf for a cup o tea and a fag.....
... and then a cigarette afterwards :lol :lol :lol :lol
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It is ironic that this proven disease causing thing should be used to fund the hospital system. As mentioned, it's amazing to think that despite it being poison, it is still sold.
I smoked heavily for thirty years, and tried everything to stop with no (or limited) success, so many times over the years. Six months ago I did manage to stop, and am fortunate enough to have a little girl so proud of her dad, and whose heart would be broken if I smoked again, that I know I have finally succeeded. But it upsets me to see what they are doing once again with taxes - now that the addiction isn't around to make me ignore the change and not think about it, I can see how terrible it is to use an addiction to squeeze taxes out of people.
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But it upsets me to see what they are doing once again with taxes - now that the addiction isn't around to make me ignore the change and not think about it, I can see how terrible it is to use an addiction to squeeze taxes out of people.
I smoked for 12 years, took me 3 months to kick it, its not easy, but you will kick it if you really want to. Smoking related diseases do put a strain on the public health purse. It is just a fair that smokers pay extra, after-all they choose to continue with every puff they take.
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Most of the crowd I grew up with were heavy smokers. Only one was hospitalized, and he was told if he kept smoking he would die. That was good enough for him. Today, none of "the crowd" smoke. Still drink like fish, but not smokers anymore.
Public awareness of cancer etc has worked. I think the government will continue to target smokers until they cannot raise their quota of revenue. They will most likely increase the tax on drinkers.
If the government could tax illegal drugs, then it would be a massive windfall for them.
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But it upsets me to see what they are doing once again with taxes - now that the addiction isn't around to make me ignore the change and not think about it, I can see how terrible it is to use an addiction to squeeze taxes out of people.
I smoked for 12 years, took me 3 months to kick it, its not easy, but you will kick it if you really want to. Smoking related diseases do put a strain on the public health purse. It is just a fair that smokers pay extra, after-all they choose to continue with every puff they take.
I had stopped smoking my self at one stage for a year and a half but then started again, when i stopped i couldn't stand the smell of people smoking, i would winge at my Neighbor when i was in my back yard and i could smell them smoking next door. Nothing worse than a reformed smoker :lol
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They have taxed tobacco to death here in the US.
I'm not a smoker, but both my parents are. And my wife's Mom does, her Dad did, but he stopped when he had heart surgery and was told to stop by his doctors.
A carton of one brand was $50 the other day when I was waiting in line to pay for something at the corner gas station and looked up at the sign. That was one of the more expensive brands, but still, damn!
A lot of people from Indiana (my state) drive south to Kentucky a few times a year and stock up, as taxes are much lower there since Kentucky makes a large portion of the tobacco consumed in the US.
I'm not educated on the numbers, but I have heard the number of smokers has dropped.
It's also frowned upon heavily in the US society. Smoking is banned in my county with the exception of bars and 'private clubs' - and in some counties here, they've even banned it in bars!
its the same over here in Aus', no smoking indoors (pubs, clubs, resturants, shopping centers, etc.) Its even illegal to smoke in a car with children under 16 over here. but i do agree with the rules,
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But it upsets me to see what they are doing once again with taxes - now that the addiction isn't around to make me ignore the change and not think about it, I can see how terrible it is to use an addiction to squeeze taxes out of people.
I smoked for 12 years, took me 3 months to kick it, its not easy, but you will kick it if you really want to. Smoking related diseases do put a strain on the public health purse. It is just a fair that smokers pay extra, after-all they choose to continue with every puff they take.
Sorry Greg, gotta disagree with ya.. very convenient to hit smokers (yes i smoke) for taxes as we are a burden.. what about people who are overweight? work too hard? play sports and get injured.. They are also an uneccessary burden on the health system (one can argue) do we tax them extra.. no. Either ban it or let us buy them without having to line government coffers.
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The government is not fair dinkum about getting people to stop smoking. Actually they love it that we smoke (I personally gave up 6 years ago). If they were serious about the problem, they would make the cost per packet $20. But if they did that they wouldn't get their taxes now would they? If nobody buys them, the government wouldn't profit. So they bump the price up little by little and the poor smoker finds and justifies a way to raise the extra bit of cash to buy the next packet - until the next price hike, and the cycle starts again. 20 years ago, the cost per packet was under $5. If I knew back then that today the cost would be so high, I would have stopped there and then. But these gradual price hikes every year or so have a certain way of playing games with your mind. You convince yourself that it's not that much extra to pay, just what Kev and Co. want you to believe.
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But it upsets me to see what they are doing once again with taxes - now that the addiction isn't around to make me ignore the change and not think about it, I can see how terrible it is to use an addiction to squeeze taxes out of people.
I smoked for 12 years, took me 3 months to kick it, its not easy, but you will kick it if you really want to. Smoking related diseases do put a strain on the public health purse. It is just a fair that smokers pay extra, after-all they choose to continue with every puff they take.
Sorry Greg, gotta disagree with ya.. very convenient to hit smokers (yes i smoke) for taxes as we are a burden.. what about people who are overweight? work too hard? play sports and get injured.. They are also an uneccessary burden on the health system (one can argue) do we tax them extra.. no. Either ban it or let us buy them without having to line government coffers.
Cool to disagree but...........
KFC vs a stinky durry...............fillet burger and chips wins hands-down!
*%*
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Dont want to pay extra tax then dont smoke I guess...
$2 extra per pack is an extra $800 or so a year for most smokers...
Give up the smokes and spend the cash on pins I say... #*# #*#
Then once pin sales go sky high they will bring out a pinball levy of some kind..lol
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Either way they are the goverment and they are there to screw us over one way or another. Another good example is offer a rebate for solar to people who can afford it they loose money on power bill so up the price of power to cover losses Brilliant... !!@
Old saying still stands the rich get richer while the poor get poorer
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I have never smoked and never will. I could never see any reason to breathe anything but fresh air.
The fact that the government allows the product to be sold is a disgrace. From a health point of view, it is poison ofcourse. But living in a democracy, people are fairly allowed to chose to smoke or not. Statistics show, that 70 percent of hospital beds are taken up by smoking related diseases. Insanity.
And the healthcare system costs the government more per annum than smoking taxes will ever bring in. If the government gets rid of tobacco, and the billions per year it brings in, they will save billions in the health care system. Tobacco is a financial liability, not a money maker.
Cigarette products shld be available only via a chemist with a pre-skription, which after a period becomes "not available" so people do quit.
!@# For people who like smoking, and the hand to mouth action etc etc, why cant someone invent a "hybrid tobacco" that tastes like it, but has no dangerous chemicals. That way, if u have to smoke u can, without harming your health.
We live in a democracy, choice should be allowed. But unfortunately, it comes at a high financial and health price. Each to their own.
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Before medical science realised how damaging smoking was, cigarettes were very widely used in the mid 20th century.
The trouble with banning cigarettes completely is that they would go black market, so it makes sense to still allow them to be sold.
It also makes sense to tax them to pay for the cost of the health consequences. Should fatty fast food be similarly taxed? Probably...
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Dont you like the way the bastards say "this will raise an extra 4 or 5 Billion $$ in the next year or two, when their estimates are obviously based on the amount of people who currently smoke and will continue to smoke, so they themselves dont actually think it will decrease the amount of smokers.
Now that is just a blatant tax grab.
As far as the old argument about smokers being a drain on the health system goes, that is just utter bullsh*t.
How much tax does the average smoker contribute to the system over a lifetime. Heaps!! and not all of them burden the health system.
How many other people are in hospital for self inflicted diseases ailments or injuries. Grossly obese people, people injured in car accidents because they were drunk or just plain stupid, drug abusers etc etc the list goes on.
Quite simply if everyone gave up the gaspers the Guvverment really would be in a pickle as to how to replace that money.
The ones I really feel sorry for are the pensioners, many of whom are by all accounts doing it tough and having a fag is their only pleasure.
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The way i look at things might seem a bit odd but to ease the burden on the health system.. Stop reviving drug addicts who OD. Stop giving liver transplants to Alcos and lung transplant to smokers etc i wont put my hand up for a new liver when i kill mine i new the risk (Give them to kids etc who deserve them) . And allow euthinasia and empty a few beds of the dying who would rather just die with whatever dignity they have left.
All Politicians are dickheads but sadly we have to live with them
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The rich get richer, and the poor get poorer...
because in both cases, neither side changes what they are doing :)
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Statistics show, that 70 percent of hospital beds are taken up by smoking related diseases. Insanity.
I don't think that percentage is correct, but I appreciate the idea, smoking is a huge preventable burden on the system. Trouble is, like petrol, most of the tax component goes to consolidated revenue. Nothing like the full amount of tax collected from petrol goers to road funding, and nothing like the full tax collected from smokes goes to hospital/health funding. The government is as addicted to smoking (for the revenue it raisers) as are the poor smokers.
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The percentage quoted (70 percent) was quoted directly from a doco showing the state of Australias health system viewed on the ABC, commissioned by the Rudd Federal Government.
70 percent of all long term bed usage in hospital is related to smoking attributed illnesses. look at how many people who are today in their late fifties and 60's did smoke all of their lives. the percentage is huge. probably 80 percent of those generations were heavy smokers, both men and women.
Sadly, some of these people who stopped smoking, still ended up dying from smoking related diseases 20 years later anyway. Life is too short as it is than to poison ya self. The government is to blame for allowing such a devastating product with chemicals designed to create addiction.
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so if all of us smokers gave up then where would the Gov' get all the money for its health upgrades?
I don't agree to the 70% thing either, if you go into the E.R. on a friday or saturday night it is full of idiots who can't handle their alcohol & idiots with Illegal drug related problems.
If they really wanted to get people to quit then they would subsidies all the quit smoking products with the tobbaco tax.
And as some one mentioned the Gov' relies on smokers smoking.
Their are many ways to stop people from smoking, I like bretts idea about making people see a doctor, but they should get the doctors to ween people off the tabbaco. the tobbaco black market will thrive for a while but if they make all smoking products illegal (papers, filters, filter tubes) then most people will give up. some people will still continue to smoke chop chop, you wont be able to stop that but it will also stop a lot of teenagers from starting the habbit in the first place.
Also they can raise the age for tobbaco sales to 21.
I enjoy having a smoke but i hate being a slave to them, and I hate what they are doing to my health.
another thing the Gov' should do is change the process that is used to make the tobbaco (all the chemicals that are used in the processing stage). I am sure they could make the way that it is processed healthier.
It comes down to why is the government allowing this product to be sold? people say its because of democracy, but there are less smokers than non smokers. and if this was the case then you would be able to by marijuana because you have a choice. then our hospitals would need more psychiatric facilities to accomodate all the extra dope smokers.
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70 percent relates to long term hospital bed users, not 2 hour bed users on a friday night due to too much piss.
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(http://i248.photobucket.com/albums/gg161/oldertoker/cigaretts.jpg)
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70 percent relates to long term hospital bed users, not 2 hour bed users on a friday night due to too much piss.
thats strange, when i was in hospital (having a lung transplant) not one person was in there due to smoking :lol
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Hey Andy, I got a funny one for you.
When u were here the other day, standing out the front having a cigarette, my 9 yr old daughter Maddi asked her mum
"how many toes does Andrew have", her mum said "why", maddi said '"cause when he smokes, do his toes drop off and go green". %.% %.% %.% %.%
Being the cheeky little shit she is, she then asked, does Andrews fingers and doodle drop off next, after his toes go green. Farkk, i just cracked up bad. @.@
I said i hope not, i need his hands to keep my pinball machines working ! Ya better quit mate before they drop off hey ! %.%
The kids have just done smoking education at school.
Any parent seen near the school, ever smoking, is chastised badly for smoking where the kids can see it and the kids are encouraged to dob in smokers etc.
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Hey Andy, I got a funny one for you.
When u were here the other day, standing out the front having a cigarette, my 9 yr old daughter Maddi asked her mum
"how many toes does Andrew have", her mum said "why", maddi said '"cause when he smokes, do his toes drop off and go green". %.% %.% %.% %.%
Being the cheeky little shit she is, she then asked, does Andrews fingers and doodle drop off next, after his toes go green. Farkk, i just cracked up bad. @.@
I said i hope not, i need his hands to keep my pinball machines working ! Ya better quit mate before they drop off hey ! %.%
The kids have just done smoking education at school.
Any parent seen near the school, ever smoking, is chastised badly for smoking where the kids can see it and the kids are encouraged to dob in smokers etc.
sounds like a good program, education is the best prevention, ^^^