The Aussie Pinball Arcade
Aussie Pinball Forums => General Discussion => General Pinball Discussion => Topic started by: swinks on June 20, 2018, 08:26:43 PM
-
I must of been hiding under rock for a while or too busy with kids and pinball and missed that as of 1st July all goods purchased from overseas will have GST added to them.
Apparently we will say goodbye to the $1000 tax free threshold and people have been saying it will catch sales through ebay etc. I was curious how the hell does the ATO push this onto overseas companies and on further research found the following from the Sydney Morning Herald paper.
The catch? “The new online tax will only be collected from self-declaring overseas retailers with turnovers of more than $75,000 and the Australian Tax Office has no power to punish those beyond the ATO’s jurisdiction,” reports The Sydney Morning Herald (https://www.smh.com.au/politics/federal/protectionist-tariff-warning-over-tax-hit-coming-for-online-shoppers-20180411-p4z8xy.html). “The tax is designed with the near impossibility of its collection in mind,” RMIT economist Christopher Berg told the newspaper. He added that the most the ATO could do to non-compliant businesses was to slow down the processing of packages at the Australian border.
It remains to be seen which overseas retailers charge, collect and remit the new tariff but we’re predicting that most of the bigger businesses will comply, given their success in the Australian market. If this means no longer shopping tax-free, let’s then hope our local retailers benefit in the process.
I am wondering what happens with companies like Pinball Life and Marco etc are they going to be bothered registering and going through the process of dealing with the ATO and if they don't, do our purchases get held up in customs for extended periods of times or will they (customs) hold it as ransom for us to pay an import duty. Or will these companies refuse to sell to Aussies as not worth the hassle.
If anyone has more knowledge, corrections etc please share...
-
I'm in no way an accountant or anyone suitable to provide advise, but I'm seeking advise from my accountant when he returns from leave.
I've read the description on the ATO website, and it is written in a language I'm never going to understand. It appears this new rule has been snuck in without any fanfare or explanation. Ambiguous is a word I don't use often, but there are too many statements I can't follow.
If you are registered for GST, you add 10% to the cost of the product you are supplying. At the end of a 3 month cycle, you pay the collected GST to the ATO, via your BAS statement. So the consumer is really paying the GST, as a GST registered business, you are simply collecting Tax for the ATO. Anything you buy, or are supplied, is returned via your business tax return.
This new rule appears to prevent Australian Businesses and consumers from buying overseas GST free for any amount. Aimed at multinationals, that are making profits, but not paying Tax in Australia. Luminaries such as the idiot at Harvey Norman, have been championing the cause, as online overseas purchases are affecting his bottom line. Poor Multimillionaires. My heart bleeds. It not like anyone would buy a mattress or wall unit "on line". Once the list of these idiots is posted, I'm boycotting their products. The mark up alone on their products is the sole reason we go overseas for products !
There is a confusing criteria regarding the import of $75,000. So is that from one overseas supplier to one Aussie business ? Is it $75,000 from that O/S supplier to all Aussie Businesses ? How does the ATO know how much the O/S supplier sells to Australians ? No O/S business is going to register with the ATO.. When 3 months has elapsed, can the O/S supplier claim back the GST from the ATO ?
It does not create more jobs. There's already massive delays out of customs, often imports are in customs longer than the time taken to arrive from O/S. The jobs should be filled now..
I don't know how it will affect RTBB or APR. But my opinion is that the ATO and Aussie Government are making consumers pay for taxes they were too scared to ask the Multinationals for (Mining companies..) for the last 10 years.
I don't know the answers, but sneaking this up on Aussie Small Business in such a covertly manner is typical.
-
you are much more experienced in business than me Nino, but I was struggling to understand some of the wording and interpretation myself.
it just seems floored, we will see how it pans out !@#
-
lols, it will be more than 10% extra
IMHO they will add a prosessing fee as well
-
I bring in stuff from OS regularly and none of my suppliers are going to register with the Australian tax office.. chances are that the GST will be applied at the point of import and the carrier will pay this upfront. This will then be passed on to the importer.. at a cost of course!
DHL already pay any fees upfront and then pass it on ... it aint cheap though as their admin costs are added.
It then becomes a choice.. pay the fee and get the goods or not pay and goods destroyed.
DHL..TNT..UPS etc will all do well out of this
-
I bring in stuff from OS regularly and none of my suppliers are going to register with the Australian tax office.. chances are that the GST will be applied at the point of import and the carrier will pay this upfront. This will then be passed on to the importer.. at a cost of course!
DHL already pay any fees upfront and then pass it on ... it aint cheap though as their admin costs are added.
It then becomes a choice.. pay the fee and get the goods or not pay and goods destroyed.
DHL..TNT..UPS etc will all do well out of this
if we had a labor federal goverment, you would think this is a favor for the postal unions
-
I wonder how this will affect the things I buy off of ebay? I regularly buy components off ebay (smd resistors capacitors transistors etc.) and the price is almost always $1 with free postage (no idea how they make a profit). Are they going to hold it up until I pay the 10c GST and the $20 handling fee? If they do, it will cost the ATO a fortune. The mind boggles!!
Mike.
-
My understanding of this (and please do not rely on it as I am not a tax specialist) is that the overseas seller only needs to register for collecting and paying GST, where the turnover (which means the gross sale price totals) from sales made to Australian buyers as part of their selling enterprise, is $75,000 or more per year (including shipping costs).
Therefore, if Pinball Resource works out that it sells in total sales about $50,000.00 a year into Australia with $2,000.00 in shipping costs, its GST turnover is $52,000.00, and therefore it does not have to register for GST purposes for the new rules, and therefore does not therefore collect any GST on its sales to Australia. Nothing therefore is changed if this is the case.
Amazon, which would I expect easily sell more than $75,000.00 into Australia per year, chucked a wobbly and said no. Not sure how much this was done to promote the AU version of its site (which no doubt 50% higher prices) than the reality - all it has to do is register, and sales made into Au automatically have 10% added at checkout, and this is remitted to the ATO - pretty easy, so I guess it was just the right time to use it to promote the Au site.
-
i think alot of pinball retailers would have over $75000 in aussie sales
Marco, PBR, even CPR
-
Anyone have any idea if, in the case of ebay, the $70,000 applies to ebay or to the individual sellers? There is no GST on gumtree (private) sales so I don't see why ebay would be any different.
Mike.
-
ebay pay tax?
lol
-
it would apply to the seller, not ebay
-
I bring in stuff from OS regularly and none of my suppliers are going to register with the Australian tax office.. chances are that the GST will be applied at the point of import and the carrier will pay this upfront. This will then be passed on to the importer.. at a cost of course!
DHL already pay any fees upfront and then pass it on ... it aint cheap though as their admin costs are added.
It then becomes a choice.. pay the fee and get the goods or not pay and goods destroyed.
DHL..TNT..UPS etc will all do well out of this
if we had a labor federal goverment, you would think this is a favor for the postal unions
Nah... unions are all about doing as little as possible for maximum reward. They already don't guarantee delivery so don't go giving them more tasks to complete... the poor souls will have to actually work
-
found this article and questions and answers at the end detail more info:
https://www.penguinaccounts.com.au/gst-low-value-imports-2018/ (https://www.penguinaccounts.com.au/gst-low-value-imports-2018/)
eg
Jonathan says
June 7, 2018 at 1:05 am
I have not been able to find an answer to this question anywhere: What happens if an Australian consumer purchases less than $1,000 of goods (where GST applies), but the overseas company selling them does not have a turnover in Australia equalling or exceeding $75,000 AUD? It would seem that in such circumstances such goods won’t be subject to GST simply because there won’t be any mechanism to collect it. And if that is the case, I hope consumers buying these goods are not penalised in any way, since it is not their fault. I know the companies I buy from overseas wouldn’t have a hope of meeting the $75,000 threshold, but then again I cannot buy the particular goods they sell from large scale suppliers anyway as they are small, specialist suppliers of “niche-market” products.
Reply
Penguin Management says
June 10, 2018 at 8:38 am
Thanks for your question, Jonathan. We’ve been getting a lot of similar enquiries lately and have updated the article with some more information for businesses with less than AUD$75,000 turnover. In short, if the overseas company you are purchasing from is not registered for GST with the Australian Taxation Office, then the recipient or consumer (you) of the goods will be contacted at the border to pay the 10% GST. Hope this clarifies it for you. The Penguin Team
-
Not a pinball company but I thought it interesting anyway. I received this on the bottom of an email from Level 9 sports a US based company I buy ski gear off from time to time.
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20180625/de36f9fe4a660999ec0cee57ea909629.jpg)
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
-
thanks for the example ^^^
-
Still confusing and deliberately unclear.
Sounds to me like the Government want to make up for the millions in Tax lost during the mining boom.
This is going to be one huge mess on July 1st..
-
here is a gst and duty calculator as a rough guide
https://www.wwcf.com.au/customs-duty-import-goods-and-service-tax-calculator/ (https://www.wwcf.com.au/customs-duty-import-goods-and-service-tax-calculator/)
-
Here's an example of how this will work.
A few years back I imported some goods for my business and kept the value of the goods under the $1000 threshold.
But, at time of arrival in Australia, the dollar had dropped and the value of the goods came to something like $1015. I then get a call from DHL ( the carriers) who tell me that the goods cannot come into Australia unless I pay the GST and import tax... do you want us to do this for you or do you want to deal with customs yourself?
Anyone who has ever tried to deal with customs knows that all the cards are stacked against you.. they will have you going in ever increasing circles of red tape, all the while, your goods are sitting in storage at customs which attracts a $170 daily fee.
So.. I agreed to have DHL pay the tax and I reimburse with my credit card. DHL then add on an administration fee and my bill to DHL came in at just under $400..
.. all this for $15
If you think that Aus Post..DHL...TNT etc are going to ask you simply for the 10%..think again as its a total money rort for these guys
-
Spoke to Aussie Post today regarding the GST implications, and they have not been provided with any such notification from the ATO or Aussie Post Head Office.
-
.. all this for $15
I too got toasted bad with a similar scenario.
-
Spoke to Aussie Post today regarding the GST implications, and they have not been provided with any such notification from the ATO or Aussie Post Head Office.
Sounds like we can all look forward to a complete cluster f*** come July 1st.
-
I have a better understanding of the process. I'm just awaiting confirmation from Border Protection (Customs).
First of all, I don't know how it will effect a consumer who buys goods from overseas from and online store "completely". If that O/S store is registered for GST, it will be built into the price and you will pay for the GST for that item. The ATO collects the GST from the supplier and your goods will be marked as "GST paid" before it hits our shores. THEN - you need the item cleared. That's the part I'm unsure of.
If that store has not registered for GST, the item sits in Customs and the consumer has to pay GST + Clearance - through a Declaration form and then it may need a Freight Forwarder to provide clearance. A really BIG mess. If you are thinking of abandoning the goods, you will be sent a letter from Border Protection to pay storage and shipping charges back to the country of origin.
For RTBB - We provide our ABN to Border Protection, and we pay GST upon entry to Australia. We clear the items (still waiting on an exact procedure) and then we onsell to the consumer +GST. I'm waiting on Border Protection to provide me with the exact procedure. It may be all done online as we are classed as an "importer of goods" and not a "consumer".
Clear as mud ?
-
GST is a monster. I am now required to collect the GST that would be paid to a developer on behalf of any purchaser client and pay that directly to the ATO, and if I miss it, I get to pay it (we are talking tens of thousands of dollars!!). All because a few developers over the years failed to remit the GST on their development sales. Sledgehammer used to fix a minor problem.
-
After waiting days for Border Protection to provide a process for GST collection for importers - they gave me a link to the ATO website. So when you ask the ATO how its done, they give you the link to the Border Protection site.
The only way is from what I've gathered ;
If you have paid for your import prior to 1st July, even AFTER your shipment arrives, it will be cleared - Fedex and USPS as examples.
If you have paid after 1st July, your goose is cooked. You will be required to pay GST AND DUTY 5% of the total shipment. You MAY have pay admin and clearance fees.
If your purchase is from eBay - non Aussie - the GST component is already added in checkout. If the shipper is eBay Global, your package will be cleared as per normal as you have paid GST. No Duty is calculated - from what I can work out.
If you are buying or selling from Forums and Facebooks groups, you will be targeted. Whatever that means - by the ATO.
RTBB / APR is now registered for GST - so we can claim GST credits etc etc.
-
Well ive just had first hand experience of this having had a phone call yesterday to pay the fees.
I normally try to keep my purchases under $1000 to avoid the GST and import tax ( extra 5%) but I figure that seeing as everything is now subject to GST, you might as well buy bigger to avoid multiple purchases.
So my normal AU$800 turned into over AU$2000.
Yesterday I received a text message and then a phone call from the carriers FedEx NSW.
Taxes are to be paid PRIOR to entry to the country and customs approval and it appears to be subject to a AU$20 admin fee..other carriers may charge more or less.
But, if you import from a non GST registered overseas company, then expect a phone call at any time and have the money ready on your credit card.
A $20 fee on a $10 item is painful... $20 on a $2000 purchase, I can live with.
-
Interesting as from what I can gather, the existing method of paying GST for items over AUS$1000 remains unchanged. Using that method, you need to fill out declaration forms or have a Freight Forwarder fill out the clearance forms (costing a fair amount of $).
Might have to try an order over $1000 and see what happens.