WPC weak flippers also getting hot

[robm]

Hi,

Helping a guy out with a Popeye - he's a new member on the forum.

2 flipper issues:
1 - Upper right mini flipper is super weak - i suspect its possibly only energising the hold winding, not the flip winding...
2 - Lower right gets hot after a few good games and gets weak when hot


'so for the upper right i have done the following

Replaced coil
Measured 65V at all 3 lugs to ground in attract mode
Swapped with a know good fliptronics board - same problem
Swapped cabinet opto switches left/right - problem stays on right, so assume opto and switches are fine
Checked everything 3 times, no mechanical binding - replaced plunger and coil stop, moves freely
EOS is normally open

So it almost seems to me the problem must/may be on the power driver board - any suggestions where to look or how to test further?

For the lower right, the problem seems to have only occurred since i had the power driver board out and did some repairs to the 5v section, although this may be co-incidence.  Again, no mechanical issues, coil has been replaced, so it seems to be electrical - but after a few good games its very hot and weak

Thanks in advacne

Rob

[beaky]

lower left flipper will over heating may be the eos.
even though it may be closing it may not be closing properly thus turning the power coil on and off several times so it will over heat.

in switch test try pressing and holding the flipper button in and then wriggle the flipper bat up and down and so on (to simulate a ball hitting it) and see if the eos turns on and off.

[pinball god]

I agree had similar problem with T2, eos spacing all wrong and it was closing too late or too soon or something I can't remember

[robm]

OK, thanks for that - with the weak upper flipper - is it driven from the fliptronics board?

If so, since i swapped with a known good board, where does this point the problem - something on the power driver board?

[beaky]

if you have replaced the fliptronics board and the flipper is still very weak it could be:
A bad connection on one of the plugs that connect to the flip tronics board.
A faulty flipper coil

if your rom version has a flipper test in the diagnostics then go through the test and select the FLIP POWER coil test for the upper flipper and see if the power coil is working in the test

[Strangeways]

Hot coil is usually the EOS switch.

Weak flipper - check the flipper moves freely by hand. There should be the same resistance as the lower flippers.

[beaky]

Weak flipper - check the flipper moves freely by hand. There should be the same resistance as the lower flippers.

forgot to mention that 
if there is a problem with the linkage, pawl or shaft you can lose power there,

[robm]

I have totally rebuilt the flipper mechs, and triple checked them, so defineitly not a mechanical/resistance issue.  I'm leaning towards a dodgy plug connection somewhere.

With the 12V regulated supply, is it OK at 11.73V?  From Clay's guide, he says its fine 11-13V - just wondered if a slightly lower 12V could affect opto performance?

[beaky]

11.73v should be fine unless the optos them selves are nearly dead.
Do you still have the over heating properly or just the weak flipper problem?

[robm]

Still haven't been back - i want to sort the weak problem first - then i thought of leaving my fliptronics board in his machine for a while and see if the overheating continues.

[robm]

Just to finish this thread off....

Ended up calling Beaky (thanks heaps mate) and talked through a few things, double checked EOS, all fine, and found that when earthing the middle lug of the coil it was still relatively weak - since i had swapped the fliptronics board to a known good one, it pointed down the coil end.  Sw i swapped the flipper coils over (the weak upper one) and it came all good.  Now i can't say for certain, but i'm farily sure it was a mechanical issue - even though i had checked it a few times, when i gave it a good look, there was some light wear marks at the end of the plunger - near the link.  So even though it seems to have moved freely without resistance, there may have been just enough to cause trouble??? I did remove the coil stop bolts and re-align them - its possible these may have been slightly out of kilter making the coil a bit cockeyed. 

The lower flipper that was getting hot was the result of the owner losing the small bush that goes in the plastic link at the end of the plunger - this introduced a whole heap of slop into the ssytem, that really only became evident when you pulled it apart.

So all sorted now, thanks again Beaky for the pointers over the phone

[beaky]

not a problem rob
glad i could give you some help