The Aussie Pinball Arcade
Aussie Pinball Forums => Restorations => Topic started by: mark jackson on July 05, 2010, 10:44:55 PM
-
Hi All, ......... a quick update on the Kings and Queens project. .. I purchased a Kings and Queens stripped playfield, and put some adds out there to see if there were any parts. I was/am deciding if I should try to build this game from the playfield up.
I got lucky, and found a parted out playfield with all the parts on the underside, as well as an original motor board. This convinced me to bite the bullet and try. I then purchased a repro backglass. .... So I have some very important bits to make a start.
I'm really after a 60's Gottlieb cabinet now, and an old wedgehead head box, so I'll have a place to begin this project. I'm also looking for the metal playfield posts which were used on this game ( as well as on Bank A Ball, World Fair, Buckaroo and othere games.)
Basically, if you have some bits from a mid 60's Gottlieb single player (wedgehead) then I'd be interested in hearing from you. I don't want to get some way through this project and then stall because I can't find some parts.... All help will be greatly appreciated. I'm thinking of making a book as I go. This should prove to be quite a ride! I'll update this post as things eventuate. Cheers, Mark
-
Mate - You have already committed to the restore the moment you bought the backglass ! What you need is a bit of patience, as you may find a head or body on eBay etc. I've seen wedgeheads (just the head) and I picked up a Far Out lower cabinet a few years ago (currently stripped and ready to be repainted as a Pro Football).
Even if you could borrow the head and or lower body from someone to fabricate from scratch - that would be a start.
-
Maybe this will help Mark ?
http://cgi.ebay.com.au/PINBALL-MACHINE-GOTTLIEB-SPIN-CARD-CLASSIC-COLLECTORS-/290451379454?cmd=ViewItem&pt=AU_CoinOp&hash=item43a04054fe
Cheers
Dave
-
Hi Mark,Any more progress on the Kings and Queens project.Sounds like you had most of the parts except for the head box internals.(Would you be able to fabricate the headbox internals from parts and photos)
Cheers Ian
-
Hi Ian, How goes it? ... The 'Kings and Queens' is in a very interesting place ........
WHAT I'VE GOT SO FAR: 1 X very good stripped playfield, 1 X playfield with nothing much on the top side but everything on the underside, 1 X motor board, Steel faceted p'field posts, and a new repro backglass ..... I also bought another 'Kings and Queens' machine, so now I have one to copy from.
WHAT I NEED TO FIND: An empty cabinet and head box for a 5 ball push -up wedgehead. I am actively on the lookout for this item, as a pinball is not much of a pinball without the box! As well as this I will need a Units, Tens, Hundreds scorereel, the free game unit in the head, and a 0-9 unit for this game. Do you know if these are 'game specific' or will any 0-9 unit do the job? .... There's also three relays in the head - a 1, 10, 100 point relay..... Then there's a front door, coin entry plate, plunger, legs etc etc.
I'll know more when I receive delivery of the p'field and motor board. The main thing would be the cabinet. Apart from this I think I can fairly easily source the other stuff. ... I'm also looking for a set of playfield plastics for this game.....
That's a quick rundown of where it's up to at present. If you have any of those parts for sale, or know where I may be able to pick them up, if you let me know it would be appreciated. This will remain a huge project for quite some time, but in these early stages I'm feeling like I can get the job done given a reasonable amount of luck.
I will continue to update this when things happen. At this stage, the p'field and motor board are due here in about October/November of this year. Cheers for now, Mark
-
I have a heap of old tortoise score reels bu not sure if they are the type you need if someone can post a photo of what the reels look like? I also have lots of relays and stuff. I might even have the manual ball lift mech if you decide to build your own cab ^^^
-
Hi Mark,
I have the gottlieb 1968 catalog here.If you pm me your address I can send you a copy of all the part numbers covering(cabinet,door,litebox,,pedestal,replay unit,gear&shaft,disc,wiper,motor cams etc for all machines between "Gaucho1963 and"Seaside late 1967" You can cross reference for part suitability for your K&Q's.Some parts on your "Sweethearts" are the same.If there are any other diagrams you need let me know and I'll do them.
Ian
-
Thanks for the interest guys. The part #s would be great, and I may well need the push up mechanism ( and the metal spoon shaped insert to cab rhs) .... My email address is kidamigo@bigpond.net.au Feel free to use this as an alternate means of communicato del pinballaroonio ........happy days, Mark
-
Hi Mark,
I've done a copy for Daniel which I'm posting to him.If you want a file sent to your email he may be able to do it for you. ^&^
Ian
-
That's not a problem if you want it scanned and emailed
-
That would be great Daniel. Thank you. My email address is below. Mark
-
An update on the project ... I've been trying to find a suitable 0-9 unit, as this is the only 'game specific' part that I have yet to acquire.....What I've learned is this. All 0-9 units are basically the same BUT ....there are three parts which have to be right. The gear and shaft #A-6554, the disc #B-8700 and the wiper#B-8701. There were many machines which had the same gear and shaft number (1968 parts catalog) but the disc and wiper are specific to each particular game (..which makes sense).
I may have to modify a disc and a wiper so they are like B-8700 and B-8701. I've been told that it has been done ... You basically make a tracing of the original disc, line it up to a doner disc and add holes/rivets where they are not present. Any rivets which are on the doner disc but not the original are just left on the disc, and disconnected on the underside of the disc. The same approach is used for the wiper. All this sounds easy if you say it quick, but........
I've not attempted to do this before, and have very little idea of tools and techniques. Also, I imagine that the closer your doner disc/wiper is to the original, then the less modifying you would have to do.???
Has anyone tried this before? If so, I'd like to hear how you went about it. Maybe there's someone who has done it a few times, and knows the tricks and pitfalls.
As usual, I really appreciate the help and feedback that I get on Aussie Pinball. No-one knows it all about pinball and the community help is great. I'm sure I'm not the only restorer who really feels the void created with the passing of the mighty mechanic Colin Smith. I used to love just watching him work on my EMs, and there was no problem that Colin could not fix. He was fearless when it came to repairing and re-building parts for pinball machines. I miss the man and the lifetime of experience and skills he had.
The only way I will be able to avoid trying this modification, is if I find a parted out 0-9 unit from a 'Kings and Queens'. Anyone got one they don't want? Thanks, Mark
-
Hi everyone, .... I'll put up a few photos and then say a bit about what's been happening.
-
.... the whole playfield is from a complete k & q.
... the half p'field shot is from the stripped playfield I bought, with Wayne Neyens signature ... (just out of shot).
... The inside of a k & q head.
... The start of making my own head board.
To date: ...playfield with parts, and motor board expected within the week. For the head I've managed to find the score-reels, 0-9 unit ..( a work in progress), add/sutract replay unit, 10 point bell unit, and large pins/sockets. There's still a few parts I need for the head but I've got the main parts. Still searching for a cabinet/head box, although I may have found a head.
Afew parts I'm still after: the mini pins and sockets on the head, which are used to set the replay scores. A main wiring harness from a Gottlieb of this era (1965 or so), the other metal found in the head ... main hinges holding the inside timber to the head (3 screws each side), a couple of the smaller pins/sockets you can see at lower right of back of head, the locking lever (attached via a big bolt from the top of the head box), any other metal found inside the head box.
So, that's about it. Mainly I've been hunting for parts, but when the main stuff arrives, I'll be hard pressed to know what to do first! Cheers, Mark .... I'll put a few more pics up
-
Progress is coming along well I have not had the chance to bundle up them parts yet hopefully tomorrow. After seeing the photos I should have the brackets and lock mech from in the head I'll take a look aswell for the reel holders (told you I would forget sorry)
-
Sure looks like a very worthwhile project Mark ^^^ and good on you, Daniel, for help with parts as usual ^^^
Looking forward to watching this one.
Cheers
Dave
-
Howdy everyone, ... Just a quick update. I think I may have a headbox (wedgehead), courtesy of 'cardini' (on the other pinball forum). ... So, to finish off the parts for the head, I'm down to the parts which I listed below. I'll put in a few pics which show the 'metal' parts I need from inside the head. ... Still after the mini pins/sockets, and a main wiring harness from the head of a 60's Gottlieb wedgehead. ... hoping the pics make it easier to show what I'm looking for. Regards, Mark .... also, does anyone know where I can get some screws similar to the two shown in the last pic?
-
How many do you need?
I'll post a picture later when I'm inside. I'm nit surebif the long ones are thick enough I have two thicknesses that are about that length
-
Hiya Daniel, I reckon I could use about 20 of the smaller screws (these hold all to stuff to the p'field underside), and about 12 of the larger ones. They look like they're about 4 mil thick to me.
-
Coming along nicely, Mark ^^^
I've found a very similar "small" screw from Bunnings - inly problem is that it is a phillip's head.
-
If you are looking for a screw in Sydney, there is a specialist nut, bolt & fastener seller named Tower Fasteners in Addison Rd, Marrickville.
I suspect that sort of screw would be bread and butter to them.
-
Hi everyone, This is my 3rd attempt to get a few pics up .... I'll say a bit about 'em when I post them. Cheers, Mark
-
.......ok......pics are up. These are of the head-board I made for Kings and Queens. I'm not sure why some of the lines have 'bent' a bit in the photos, but they're straight in reality. I tried to make this as close to factory specs as I could get it. The differences are: timber... I used cheap pine for both parts, and have no chip-board. I hate the stuff and anything has got to be better. I paint all my headboards white. The factory makes a token pass at a white covering. I just do it a bit more thoroughly. One pic also shows the front bottom edge. The factory shaves this edge at 45 degrees, so that edge won't scratch the backglass when the backboard is lowered. I made this edge rounded. I can never believe just how rough the backboard is in pinnies of the 60's and 70's. They were really pretty cheap and nasty when it came to parts of the machine that you couldn't see. So the backboards were typically very rough, with sharp edges and rough finish on the timber. I just tried to smooth all edges and surfaces, as I imagine they would've done it had they not been so concerned with 'profit'.
I'm enjoying re-building this head, even though it still seems a huge task to me. I'm now reconditioning score-reels and the other stuff and positioning them correctly on this backboard. .... still haven't begun modifying the 0-9 unit. I need to gather all my strenght and patience for this job. ... Cheers and have a great weekend. Mark
-
Awesome job, Mark - well done so far. Yuo will need heaps of patience as this project goes together, so enjoy it !
-
Looking good Mark I've found you a few of then screws you needed I'll try get then in the post this week
-
Great job Mark . ^^^
-
Thanks for the encouragement. ... I got an offer... of a free cabinet/head for a 5 ball push up Gottlieb 60's single player. ... Perfect except it's in USA. More specifically, it's in Olean NY (New York State) .... I am prepared to pay a reasonable amount if I can do a deal with someone who is bringing over a container or some other goods which it could go with. .... If anyone knows how I might get this empty head/cab (16 and 73 pounds approx) over here, please let me know. It's a generous offer, but normal shipping charges will make it 'over the top'. ... Mark
-
Thanks for the encouragement. ... I got an offer... of a free cabinet/head for a 5 ball push up Gottlieb 60's single player. ... Perfect except it's in USA. More specifically, it's in Olean NY (New York State) .... I am prepared to pay a reasonable amount if I can do a deal with someone who is bringing over a container or some other goods which it could go with. .... If anyone knows how I might get this empty head/cab (16 and 73 pounds approx) over here, please let me know. It's a generous offer, but normal shipping charges will make it 'over the top'. ... Mark
I have the same problem
I am trying to get a Stern Trident backglass over from the USA and the freight is very expensive, not really worth the trouble.
If you get anywhere I would be interested.
-
'Evening all, I'll try a few pics.
-
.....the pics show where the project is up to. There's one of the head board that I'm making from scratch. I'm waiting on a few more parts before doing more. The motor board is almost completed. The other two shots are of the playfield I bought which originally started this madness. It was stripped on both sides when I got it and I've just begun to put some stuff on. All the bits on the underneath side have come from the parted out p'field I bought. I'm almost ready to 'transport' the wiring and relay bank from the parted out p'field to the one I'm building up. So far I've been on this project for about 6 months. It took a while for parts to arrive, and I'm reasonably happy with where it's up to.
..... Still needing: the top arch metal (4 pieces in total); the rhs timber 'framing' piece for the p'field; a cabinet (5 ball push up preferred) and an empty wedgehead box. ... Apart from that, a front door, and a few things I've forgotton, I've managed to source most of the parts. Thanks to you guys who have helped me out. It's only restorers who have a lot of this stuff now. Even the mighty PR cannot supply all that I needed for this project. When playfield and motor board are completely finished, I intend to drop them in to the Kings & Queens complete game I have, and see if they will work. That should be an exciting and probably frustrating day. I'll put up more pics as more work gets done. Cheers, Mark
-
Gday Mark .
This is going to look fantastic when completed.
Sure looks like you are keeping up to your high standard with this one *%*
Cheers
Dave
-
I think I might be able to help out with the top ball arch (4 metal pieces). I have a Recel (gottlieb parts) Space Race. If the parts are the same, they are yours.
I know it is in storage - I'll see if I can have a look over the weekend and confirm
http://www.ipdb.org/showpic.pl?id=2257&picno=13189 (http://www.ipdb.org/showpic.pl?id=2257&picno=13189)
GReat progress BTW #*#
-
...... a few developments. I have managed to get a Wedgehead, courtesy of 'cardini' (..the 'other' forum) which has scrubbed up real nice. I bit the bullet and ripped off the front panel as it was real sad. I made a new piece and it looks like a different head now. I'll put up some pics soon.
.... tonight was also the night when I drilled the holes on the 0-9 unit, for the extra rivets/wiper which will make a Bank A Ball 0-9 unit behave as if it was a Kings & Queens 0-9 unit. Several holes had to be drilled and I was sweating on this part, as it's the critical part of modifying a 0-9 unit. ... if the holes aren't in the right place, then the right contact/s are not going to happen. I think I got it right, but will know more after I put it back together, after the re-wiring of the unit.
...Still looking for a Gottlieb 5 ball push up cabinet, the arch metal (4 pieces), RHS timber piece which is RHS piece of the ball shooter lane... I reckon the cabinet is the last of the main parts I'll need, and I'd sure like to use an original Gottlieb box, without having to get one made up. We'll see... Cheers, Mark
-
Keep up the good work mark makingreat. Progress with this one
-
That's good news on the cab - look forward to more pictures of your progress.
-
....a few pics
-
The pics below: there's a 'before' and 'now' pic of the wedgehead. I took the front panel right off and made a new one from plywood I got at Bunnings. There's also a pic of the 0-9 disc with the new rivets added, and the wiper with the additional snow-shoe wiper added to that.
...... I did encounter a few problems when I was re-wiring the disc. The original disc is an arch shape, and is a 4" disc. The disc I used is circular and is a 3" disc. The problem is that with the arch style, there's room for some wires to be sent to the outside of the disc and not touch any rivets on the actual circle of rivets. I first thought that these rivets which were not part of the circle all connected to the rivets on the circle/s. Most do, but not all, as I found out when I began the re-wire. The solution to this was to just solder one end of these wires where they should be, and then just let them 'fall' below the level of all the connectors on the outside of the circle. I can either solder them straight to the incoming wire/s, or add a small bracket with connectors on it and solder these wires to that, and then join with the incoming wires. ... I'll leave it a while and see.
Now that I see how to do this job, I may start again if I can find an arch and wiper that are the same size (4" on original). The main thing for the disc is that it should have as many rivets on the two outside circles as possible. ( I can rivet in the 5 rivets on the small circumference within the two main 'circles'. The main thing for thw wiper is that it should have 3 pairs of wipers, spaced at 120 degree intervals. If anyone has such an arch/wiper I'd like to buy it. Then I'll have another go at 0-9 mods. It will work as I have done it at the moment, but I'm not too thrilled about running some wires straight off the back of the 0-9 unit, to the incoming wire/s. I'd also rather not 'add' any bracket etc to make these wires 'stable' and hard wired to any bracket I may come up with.
The main thing is that I've managed to make the 0-9 unit behave in exactly the same way as the original, with exactly the same wiring configuration. ...It took me two days and one night to complete the mods on the 0-9 unit. ...I always go slowly, ... especially when it's a 'first time' type repair, as in this case.
Now I can begin the re-wire of the head. ... looking for a wiring harness off of any electro-mechanical machine. Is there one out there? ... Cheers, Mark
-
Here's what you were after - see pic
I also have the timber pieces for the ball arch side pieces. The metal arch has surface rust and the paint has lifted - it will need to be cleaned up and powder coated. Better than nothing ^^^
-
It looks fine to me. Thanks for answering the call.
-
Good work Nino ^^^
-
Mark - I have what I beleive you were after - the wooden playfield sections ?
-
Hi Nino, The wooden pieces are just what I need. ... fantastic. Thanks for taking time to dig these out too. Mark
-
Hi Nino, The wooden pieces are just what I need. ... fantastic. Thanks for taking time to dig these out too. Mark
Anything else you might need, Mark ?
-
Hey Nino, .... since you asked, ... the metal piece that goes across the back of the head. This is where the back door 'sits' inside the head... and I'll soon be needing a new or near new set of flipper plungers with the bakelite strip attached. (to suit the 60's style of flipper linkages you have already offered me.) ... Geez Nino, don't get me started!! ... All I've done for the last 6 months is either buy parts/look for parts/been given a few parts. ...I'm actually 'tired' from worrying about parts. ... but your help has been invaluable, and will enable me to finish the playfield. I finished the 2nd colour of the head today. Still to be clear coated. Wiring the head is going well and slowly, mainly because I don't have enough of the right wiring. I'm starting to see some logic in the mass of wires now, and am less daunted than before. .... I'm reminded of the old saying .."a little bit of knowledge in the wrong hands is a dangerous thing." I'll put some up to date pics up soon. Cheers, Mark
-
Unfortunately I don't have the rear channel, and most of the plungers / links I have a worn. I think you can get the kit from PBR minus the pawls (which I'm sending to you).
PM me your address and I'll post everything to you.
-
...a few pics of the head in various stages.
-
Happy New Year to everyone. Yesterday (1/1/11) was one of the most exciting days in pinball restoration that I have ever had. I had been re-wiring the head that I made for Kings & Queens, and yesterday I finished, and decided to give it a run on the K & Q machine to see how I went. All worked fine, which was a bloody great shock, and a very pleasant surprise for me.
I still have 2 small problems ...1. The units reel does not activate the tens reel when it gets past 9. Units reel works fine but doesn't change the tens reel when it should. 2. The thousands light does not come on when it should. .... But apart from those two little things, the rest works just like the other K & Q head.
I couldn't believe that I actually made a whole head and that it worked!! This was always going to be the hardest part of this project, and now it's 'finished'. I'm going to tie the wiring with the waxy string (when I get some), and leave this new head on the machine for a few weeks so I can find the 2 small things that are not working as they should. Also, just to run this head in, as these parts all come from another machine, and have not been in a working state for many years, until I rounded them up for the head I made.
For some of you, this might have been easy, but for me, this was the most extensive thing I've tried to do in pinball restoration. I still can't believe that I pulled it off. As they say, ...'Luck's a fortune). Cheers, Mark
-
What a stunning effort and a great result - I don't think too many people would attempt what you've achieved.
Sensational #*# #*# #*#
-
Congratulations Mark ^^^ . Just goes to show once again that perserverance and patience pay off . Your machine is looking fantastic. No doubt when you play it you will often think of your most challenging project and enjoy it even more.
Very Well Done
Cheers
Dave
-
Congratulations on a fine job.
Persistence, patience, inspiration, resourcefulness and a touch of mania can do wonders.
-
Awesome !
A tribute to your persitence and attention to detail. Very pleasing result !
-
Congrats to you Mark. #*# Well done.
A huge effort indeed.
$&&
Cheers
Bruce
-
Awsome work mark. And working first attempt how good is that and you were doipting yourself. I knew you could do it. Well done
-
Fantastic effort Mark.Restoration on a whole new level for anyone into em's.
Ian
-
WOW WHAT AN EXCELLENT MACHINE! It looks amazing! BETTER THAN NEW! ^&^ @@* !!! It makes me want it, I kno most people would pay all sorts of $$$ for that! #*#WELL DONE! #*#
-
Gotta admit.. stunning stuff Mark... Done good with only the two minor glitches. rewiring a head is not something many of us would like to take on.. me included.
Good on ya mate ^^^ ^^^
-
A huge task and mammoth effort. You should be proud ^^^
Greg
-
Stunning looks fantastic well done
-
Thanks alot for your positive comments. I thought I'd mention the problems I had and what they actually were. I'm thinking of those of you new to fixin' pinballs. ... In reality there were 3 problems I encountered when I plugged in the head I made.
1. The fuse for the backbox just blew out immediately I pressed the replay button or coin switch contact. Whenever I find this problem, I take it that the machine is trying to tell me something. .... It doesn't like something a real lot, otherewise it wouldn't blow fuses right off. So, I went looking for the cause. It could have been that I wired something wrong, but I didn't think so. Whenever you use solder there is always the chance that some of it 'spills' onto a part it shouldn't. ... and of all the places to look I felt like the soldering of the wires to the lights of the screreels was the most likely place that I would have messed it up. I say this because this was the place where it was hard to manouver. When I looked I saw that some solder was touching the body of the light socket. I bent the connection point away from the light socket body (3 mm approx).... Then I hit the replay button again, and the machine lit up.
2. The unit score reel didn't change the tens reel once it went past 9. To my knowledge this is always because the contact points in the units score reel which is supposed to make contact at '9' wasn't doing this. To adjust this easily on a 60's machine I always take off the actual score-reel from the unit. Then it's easy to see and adjust the contact points so they close on '9'. .... Problem solved.
3. The thousand light was not coming on. I gave the female socket for this wire a slight squeeze with the pliers. It then worked for a game or two, but then it didn't. This sent me straight away to the soldering iron and I resoldered where the wire joins to the female socket. When ever the connection or contact point is intermittent, it always pays to resolder that particular place. Most 'dry' solder joins look ok, but it only takes a minute or two to resolder a connection or contact point. It fixed this last problem and the head has been raging since I fixed those small problems.
I hope this rave is useful to those who have not done much of this type of repair work. All 3 of the problems I had are typical and their solution was also typical for that problem. Cheers, Mark
-
Hi All, I'm back at it again, as I may have found a cabinet BUT it will have no metal parts usually found in the cabinets. I'll put a few pics up, but basically I'm looking for ALL the metal pieces, plus rails that are on a cabinet like this (mid 60's Gottlieb cab). All assistance will be greatly appreciated. Cheers, Mark
-
this look like some of what your after?
-
That looks fantastic Daniel. Could you pm me a few details ... I see that there's the banana piece, and a 5 ball push up mech, and a plunger???
Regarding the rails, ... would you also have the plastic insert pieces that are actually the 'runner/s' for the p'field glass? .......... what about the Left and Right metal towards the back (inside of cab) which the playfield sits on when pulling it up to look at things...they're long sort of funny 'M' shaped affairs (L & R)??
Thanks for getting back so quick .... Regards, Mark
-
Hi Mark
Yes I have the plastic glass channel &&
I'm sure I also have the m shaped things but will have to dig much deeper to find them (if they are still there). If not these can easily be made from angle iron cut into shape until originals can be found. Checked Out ipdb and noticed I've found the wrong shooter plate will take a look for the one you need tomorrow if I remember.
I definately don't have the playfield latch thing I'd remember that monstrosity sitting around the garden shed lol
If you don't hear from me tomorrow please shoot me a reminder to much shot going on at the moment.
-
If you have part numbers, PBR may be able to help ?
I do have some pall lift assemblies - i'll have a look for you on the weekend, Mark.
-
thank you kindly. I still have to wait a week or so for the cabinet?? but the offer to help is fantastic. At present things are going very slowly, as I'm waiting also for the arch metal to come back from the chromers. I've redone the apron (using the transfer that Pinball Rescue offer), but will not put it on until I do the arch metal at the top. When I do this, I'll put on the wooden framing piece (RHS). Then it will be time to put apron on. That should just about finish the playfield, except for the p'field plastics which will hopefully be done soon by Pinball Rescue. There's not too much to do with pinball restoration that doesn't involve lots of time .... either in the work required or the waiting time for some parts etc. I've actually spent more time trying to find a cabinet than it took to build the whole head!!!
-
There's not too much to do with pinball restoration that doesn't involve lots of time .... either in the work required or the waiting time for some parts etc. I've actually spent more time trying to find a cabinet than it took to build the whole head!!!
Not to mention patience and persistence eh Mark.
Amazing job you have done so far ^^^
-
I'll try some pics of the Apron. I used the decal from Pinball Rescue. I 've done this now three different times and it's a great product. I also put mylar on the surfaces where the ball travels. This will prevent any further wear and tear on this part of the machine, and be easy to clean too. ... Metal got primer and then spray can of 'appliance white'.
-
Apron looks great Mark . I've used the Pinball Rescue decals a couple of times now and agree they are a great product.
Good idea re the mylar .. hadn't thought of doing that .
-
I'll try some pics of the Apron. I used the decal from Pinball Rescue. I 've done this now three different times and it's a great product. I also put mylar on the surfaces where the ball travels. This will prevent any further wear and tear on this part of the machine, and be easy to clean too. ... Metal got primer and then spray can of 'appliance white'.
Great idea with the mylar.
I've used them on drop targets before but not on the apron.
-
Nice work on the apron Mark.... Guess what???? I forgot to look for the playfield brackets *!@
I will forget again hopefully not but if you could send me a PM on tuesday or wednesday to remind my
-
thank you kindly. I still have to wait a week or so for the cabinet?? but the offer to help is fantastic. At present things are going very slowly, as I'm waiting also for the arch metal to come back from the chromers. I've redone the apron (using the transfer that Pinball Rescue offer), but will not put it on until I do the arch metal at the top. When I do this, I'll put on the wooden framing piece (RHS). Then it will be time to put apron on. That should just about finish the playfield, except for the p'field plastics which will hopefully be done soon by Pinball Rescue. There's not too much to do with pinball restoration that doesn't involve lots of time .... either in the work required or the waiting time for some parts etc. I've actually spent more time trying to find a cabinet than it took to build the whole head!!!
Hope you dont mind me asking but what was the price on rechroming ? .
-
I haven't paid the bill yet but it won't be less than $200. .... This is for one top arch piece, with the two short straight bits (where the screws pass through)...also for the small ball stopper metal piece and the piece where the ball leaves the firing lane and enters the p'field. ... Nino gave me these parts and what with the price of the chrome they still don't wind up cheap....but hey, isn't that the way of it in pinball restoration land. The other rub is that so far the firm I gave them to has had the parts for over 2 months!! My patience wears thin on this as it's been too long. I love firms that invite you to leave a message and then seldom if ever return the call.
-
A pic or two???
-
...the head from the 'original' K & Q. This is why I'm re-painting this head too.
-
the metal parts Nino kindly gave me, after they came back from getting worked on.
-
...the blank playfield (which started this whole affair) ...almost complete but for two small metal bits and the p'field plastics. Can you tell which two bits are not there???
-
...just one more...
-
WOW !
Patience has paid off. Outstanding !
-
Fantastic results, looks great ^^^
-
Thats looking awsome Mark. i Still have the lift mech here but having trouble finding the playfield brackets did you want me to post what i have then post the rest if i find them?
-
Great looking playfield Mark . This game is going to look fantastic ^^^ . I sure admire your persistence.
-
Thanks for your positive comments and support. Daniel, if you could just keep aside the relevant bits that would be great. ... I'm still 'waiting on' for the 60's wedgehead cabinet. When (if) I get this it will come with no rails, no metal at all, so when it arrives I'll put up the flag for all of those metal pieces. If you had said to me when I began this job that the hardest part would be finding a cabinet, I would have thought you were speaking a foreign language. This really 'burns' as I have had very generous offers from US, a couple of guys are happy just to give me a cabinet.... Sadly, the freight costs just put it out of the game.
While I'm here, I'll mention a few parts that I'm still trying to find
1. A back door from any wedgehead.
2. The 'U' shaped metal on the base of the head which the back door sits in.
3. Small metal 'bridge' part (rectangular with a curve to it) which sits across the ball shooter lane, up near where the balls leave the lane and enters the playfield.
4. The funny metal bit which attaches from the apron to the outside right timber lane piece. This is where the ball actually comes up to the firing lane.
I know that pinball resource has these small metal bits but if I don't have to give my bank $25 for making a US dollar draft, then I'd rather not. Every time I have to get a US draft, I just can't help but tell the bank that it's akin to legalised robbery. They must be sick of hearing this from me but I look on it as my duty to tell them this. If they get enough customers complaining about their outrageous fees, then MAYBE they'll re-think this greedy self serving attitude they have to their customers.....You know the 'customers' ... the people that put their money in a bank and make it possible for them to have and stay in business.
As it's a rainy day today ther'll be no pinball work done. I might get 'online' and play my favourite western game 'The Call Of Juarez'. Is anyone else into this fun but timewasting activity? Have agreat day everyone. Cheers, Mark
-
I've been doing the 2nd head of Kings & Queens. I'll put up some pics of the 'webbing' I did, and the 'tool' I use to to this. I always try to get the skewer fibres to be mangled at the end and pointing in different directions. Then I wipe off most of the paint on paper. Then you can give it a bit of a twirl on the box and get that 'random squiggle' look that these machines originally had. This is a hard part of cabinet restoration. I guess there are a lot of different methods but this is as close as I know how to get it. I also work on the premise that "less is more" when it comes to webbing on the box.
-
Hi Everyone, ...a few pics.
-
...The pics are: The inside of the head that I made, after the wiring has been tied by the waxy string. It maked the whole thing very stable and 'strong'.
There's a couple of shote of the two heads I've redone, and one pic of the 'blank' playfield, which was the start of all this.
It seems like I can pick up a cabinet next week. It will be missing the rails, and all the cabinet metal pieces. Mike Shalhoub has the front piece for me, but I'm on the hunt for everthing else. I'll put some pics up soon of all this metal. Basically, if it's metal and comes off a wedgehead, then I guess I need it. If anyone has this stuff for sale, please let me know. The cabinet is the last main component to deal with, and I'm exhausted looking for parts and bits and stuff for this restoration. It's been fun, but all good things come to an end and I'm looking forward to finishing this. Along the way I've really done 2 'Kings & Queens'. ...
-
Ive still got them rails here and the ball lift assembly when your ready Mark ^^^
-
Coming along nicely - will look great next to your Sweethearts.
-
Thanks guys, I'll put up a few pics. .... I finally got a five ball push-up cabinet, which I'll also show. So, I'm now "putting up my hand" regarding the metal parts for this cab. Rails, push-up stuff, plunger unit, Gottlieb's locking bar and brackets, the 2 pieces of metal found where the glass fits up into the machine, close to the head, 60's flipper 'actuating arms' I think they're called, the weird 'M' shaped metal for holding the playfield inside the cab, even the metal rings for where the flipper buttons go, and of course the big metal which sits on top of the front panel. .... gee, there's a lot of stuff when I list it all so any help with this will be really appreciated. Anyway, some pics. Cheers, Mark
-
....the cab .....
-
.. a fistful of pics, ... and a few pics more.
-
Will take a look should have the metal bit that the glass slides into see how I go
-
Thanks once more Daniel. You already have shares in this machine!
-
I might have siderails from a GTB "Far Out" that might be of use. I'll have a look for you Mark. The Ball Shooter assy I think is "standard" across all the GTBs from 60's onwards ? PBR sell these as a complete unit.
Great pictures BTW !
-
Thanks Nino. ... another shareholder in this resto.
-
various pics of the cabinet.
-
......the pics show the inside bottom, where I glued a 3 ply 'insert'. I also did this to the outside of the cabinet but when painted becomes invisible. ... Other pics show blue, and the tape up for the red circles. This is not the easiest design to do in some ways.
-
A lot of fiddly prep work there Mark . Is painting the cab the last part of this ground up build ?
-
Been a while Mark - Do you still need the siderails ?
-
Hi pinnie mates, Yeah I do still need a set of rails for this. I managed to get most of the metal from a buddy of mine in USA. It's still in transit but he's been a great help to me in this insane project. I reckon I might have been finished now, except I had to wait 6 months for this cabinet. Whenever I take a 'break' in a major resto it's always hard to re-build my energy levels up to where I am making fair progress again. However, I'm almost taped up for the red circles. This tape-up took me 4-5 days believe it or not!
One interesting point: If you look below to the pic of the cab when it was still a 'Gigi' cab (glue still drying) .... then the box is actually repaired, strong and solid in every way. The whole thing about the 3 ply on the inside and outside of the cab is 95% just for the look of things. It also provides that extra support and stability for this area. But as I never let the bottom of my cabinets get wet, or even touch the ground without using a towel or something, I know this box will last another 100 years. .... as long as someone doesn't let it sit in water or something stupid like that.
Painting this cab is the last major part left to do. But then I have to put all the metal on the cab, and then I'll be able to put p'field and motor board in and see how we go. When I swapped motor boards over (about 6 months ago) the motor board did blow a fuse so I'm not entirely 'out of the woods' yet. I'm hoping that I'll be able to sort that out without too much trouble or strife. ... still also sweating on Pinball Rescue doing the Kings & Queens playfield plastics so still some months away from 'mission accomplished'. Lucky that I've always loved this machine ... There have been times with this project where I have questioned my own sanity, but overall this is proving to be one of the most satisfying pinball projects I've done. For any of you that haven't had much experience with 60's machines or 2" flippers: do yourself a favour sometime and get a single player, 5 ball push-up Gottlieb wedgehead from about 1960-1967. After a lifetime of interest in pinballs I still rekon these are the greatest pinballs ever made. Tony (Illawarra Steelers) has called them the 'Rolls Royce' of pinball machines and he is right on the money there. Have a great day guys. Rain rain and more rain......
-
Hi pinnie mates, Yeah I do still need a set of rails for this.
Hi Mark - I'm sure I have a set for you ^^^
-
Looking great Mark what a job with all them circles. How are you making them? The day you play your first game on this beauty u will need a crow bar to remove the smile I think
-
Gotta agree... looking great and what a journey its been!
The repeated geometric designs that GTB had look simple but are in fact very difficult to get right. even drawing these up on my computer is much more work then i could envision...
Capt Kidd.. seen here...
(http://i488.photobucket.com/albums/rr243/retropin/Cptkiddside.jpg)
Did my head in!!!
-
Capt Kidd looks like it's even harder to do! I reckon anything with big arcs or part/s of circles is hard. I did my circles by using a can of coconut milk from the cupboard. It had the correct circumference (51-52mm) and I used it unopened. This meant that the can was strong enough to cut the circumference with a pencil craft knife. I then use 400 grit paper to smooth off any inconsistency in the circle shape that I cut out. Then I cut each circle shape out so it's square on the edges and then I can position the circle part so that it's the same distance (top & bottom) and (left and right) from the border/s of the "Square" that it sits in. ....Probably not the best explanation but I'm sure you get the idea. To check: I run the tape measure from the front to the back of cab and see that all the circles are in a 'straight line' from the front to the back. I found that if you measure and place each circle carefully, then all circles should wind up in a 'straight' line. When I measured this box (especially the blue squares I found that all squares were not exactly the same size. Most were 88mm but every 4th square turned out a little bigger (89 or 90 mm). I put this down to factory error and tried to correct this as I did my vertical lines for the blue. I also used fairly thin cardboard so that I could cut reasonably 'cleanly' and without breaking my hand. I then stuck the circle cutouts down with masking tape at top, bottom, left and right. When all circles are down I then masked out all other bits of the box. Now when I go to spray, there should only be the circles themselves that are exposed and ready for the paint. .......No painting today though .... just too wet for good drying.
-
Geez Mark .. what a painful excercise ! . I've found it hard enough redoing the artwork for my Gulfstream .. let alone something like yours
-
...Howdy all, Here's a couple of pics of the red circles. This is before any clear coat to finish the job.
-
Nice one Mark . All that effort paid off I see
-
yeah, I've learned the hard way that you are much better off to spend time taping up right, (and using the right kind of tape to mask with), rather than spend twice as long doing touch-up, and 'hide-outs' where the paint bled, ran or some other horrible thing. I absolutely hate doing touch-up work on a cabinet, and try to get it so I have none to do after a re-spray. A little thing here or there is ok but more than that means the preparation just wasn't good enough. Anyway, it's always good to get to this point and from here the clear coating is a breeze.
-
yeah, I've learned the hard way that you are much better off to spend time taping up right, (and using the right kind of tape to mask with), rather than spend twice as long doing touch-up, and 'hide-outs' where the paint bled, ran or some other horrible thing. I absolutely hate doing touch-up work on a cabinet, and try to get it so I have none to do after a re-spray. A little thing here or there is ok but more than that means the preparation just wasn't good enough. Anyway, it's always good to get to this point and from here the clear coating is a breeze.
Yep .. know exactly what you mean Mark .. ran into probs with the repaint on the Gulf Stream I'm doing at the moment.
Really should have stripped one side back and started again rather than trying to touch it up , but it doesn't look too bad
-
Hi everyone, I'll try a few pics and then say a bit about them
-
.....same pic twice ... sorry.
-
Hi evryone, These pics were taken before I put the rails on the machine I made, but apart from that both games are fully playable. I'd like to call 'finish' on this project, but it's not quite there. I still have the instruction card and score card to do, as well as a coin chute for the front door. (I did the rails between taking these shots and now). ... If you chase this post back to the beginning, you'll see that the machine on the left has been made starting from a stripped playfield. ... everything else came after that. It's taken me about 18 months of fairly solid work, although there was a lot of waiting for parts at different stages. I'd like to thank everyone who helped me with parts, and in particular Nino and Daniel from this forum. You have both been very supportive and generous, even just giving me different parts along the way. This is greatly appreciated as the cost was like a 'leaky drip' for most of the time it took. Also John Selewski from the USA supplied me with many of the original Gottlieb parts for the head and the cabinet.
Later, I might detail what everything cost and how I rounded up the stuff to do this, but at the moment I'm happy just to play a game of pinball. Both machines have been fully restored, and now I'm going to sell one (the one I bought to copy from)... no one needs two of the same machine. Buyers with serious intent are welcome to arrange personal inspection. .... On other matters my wife and I have just come back from a month in the USA. We spent most of our time in Wyoming and Utah, and saw many places on the old Outlaw Trail. Hole In The Wall in central Wyoming was just fantastic, and folks there still talk about Butch (Cassidy) like he's about to walk through the door. We also went to Browns Park and Robbers Roost which are the other 2 main 'stations' along the Outlaw Trail. We had a terrific time, so finding motivation for pinball resto's is not easy right now. However, I do have an Ace High in need of some TLC so .... It's in the wrong cabinet so if anyone has a Gottlieb woodrail cabinet just collecting dust then I'm after one. The only bummer about travelling in Sept is I missed all the finals of the AFL, and now have to wait 6 months for a game. Anyway, have a great weekend. Cheers, Mark
-
Well done Mark. There were a few times I thought you were about to give up I'm really glad you stuck it out. Only a select few of us dumb enough to build a game from just a playfield. Which reminds me I must get on Timbi about my firepower playfield
-
Outstanding achievement Mark! I guess we never really know the height of the hill we are about to climb... yours was pretty bloody high!
Well done on restoring this machine.. from the pics it looks really nice... but i think a bigger kudos has to be given for even contemplating this ( personally i thought you were bloody bonkers) and then to see it through...well...
.. I take my hat off to you..
Gav
-
Definitely a huge effort, and a true testament to your perseverance and attention to high detail. I was more than happy to help out with the spares.
They both look amazing !
^^^
-
Great effort, well done, they look tremendous! ^^^
-
What a project you took on there Mark, and what an excellent result . Superb work . ^^^ ^^^
Well done to those guys who were able to help Mark out , and well done Mark for not giving up on your idea. #*#
-
Fantastic job, all the hard work has paid off ^^^