The Aussie Pinball Arcade
Aussie Pinball Forums => General Discussion => News & Announcements => Topic started by: Caveoftreasures on May 15, 2015, 04:46:00 PM
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If you can find a currency Pro at $5500 USA given our 80 cents trading figure compared to the USA $.
5500 adds 1100 with dollar difference is now $6600 Aust
Now add 10 percent gst to Aust is $6600 plus $660 is $7240 Aust
Then add import duties n customs to Australia and u are going to get high 7,s to just under 8 grand Aussie for a BNIB Pro.
Sounds roughly right using some quick calculations in my head.
Negotiate delivery n shaker and u are a happy camper.
So, dealers pay the retail price?
Here's one roughly calculated alternative: Dealer cost US $3,250. Add shipping US $350 = US $3,600. Add customs & GST = US $4,140. In $Aud terms this is $5,175 into the country. Sell Price $7,950 (incl. additional GST approx $200). In this one example markup exceeds $2,600 from which the distrib. then needs to deduct local expenses to determine profit.
Those calculations IMO are way off but.
The GST, Customs cost, Airfreight and handling charges (airfreight or sea freight) all need to be exact otherwise it's a wild guess. And the original assumption of what a USA Dealer pays Stern could also be way off.
I have been told exact figures from both an Aust Dealer and a USA Dealer but the whole "how much are they making profit" has been done before and it's always the same and ends up being a total guess fest.
All I can say is, is that I like to ask the current BEST Cash pricing, and then negotiate on coin mechs or delivery or shakers etc.
Other than that, there is no point in worrying about who makes what. Everyone has to eat and every business has to make a healthy profit to survive.
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If you can find a currency Pro at $5500 USA given our 80 cents trading figure compared to the USA $.
5500 adds 1100 with dollar difference is now $6600 Aust
Now add 10 percent gst to Aust is $6600 plus $660 is $7240 Aust
Then add import duties n customs to Australia and u are going to get high 7,s to just under 8 grand Aussie for a BNIB Pro.
Sounds roughly right using some quick calculations in my head.
Negotiate delivery n shaker and u are a happy camper.
So, dealers pay the retail price?
Here's one roughly calculated alternative: Dealer cost US $3,250. Add shipping US $350 = US $3,600. Add customs & GST = US $4,140. In $Aud terms this is $5,175 into the country. Sell Price $7,950 (incl. additional GST approx $200). In this one example markup exceeds $2,600 from which the distrib. then needs to deduct local expenses to determine profit.
Those calculations IMO are way off but.
The GST, Customs cost, Airfreight and handling charges (airfreight or sea freight) all need to be exact otherwise it's a wild guess. And the original assumption of what a USA Dealer pays Stern could also be way off.
I have been told exact figures from both an Aust Dealer and a USA Dealer but the whole "how much are they making profit" has been done before and it's always the same and ends up being a total guess fest.
All I can say is, is that I like to ask the current BEST Cash pricing, and then negotiate on coin mechs or delivery or shakers etc.
Other than that, there is no point in worrying about who makes what. Everyone has to eat and every business has to make a healthy profit to survive.
Aye, but there's steak and eye fillet Wagyu and with no competition its easy to continually eat the Wagyu
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Aye, but there's steak and eye fillet Wagyu and with no competition its easy to continually eat the Wagyu
yes, but I know the farm where my steak grew up is free from chemicals
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Aye, but there's steak and eye fillet Wagyu and with no competition its easy to continually eat the Wagyu
yes, but I know the farm where my steak grew up is free from chemicals
Wise move young Pete....
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If you can find a currency Pro at $5500 USA given our 80 cents trading figure compared to the USA $.
5500 adds 1100 with dollar difference is now $6600 Aust
Now add 10 percent gst to Aust is $6600 plus $660 is $7240 Aust
Then add import duties n customs to Australia and u are going to get high 7,s to just under 8 grand Aussie for a BNIB Pro.
Sounds roughly right using some quick calculations in my head.
Negotiate delivery n shaker and u are a happy camper.
So, dealers pay the retail price?
Here's one roughly calculated alternative: Dealer cost US $3,250. Add shipping US $350 = US $3,600. Add customs & GST = US $4,140. In $Aud terms this is $5,175 into the country. Sell Price $7,950 (incl. additional GST approx $200). In this one example markup exceeds $2,600 from which the distrib. then needs to deduct local expenses to determine profit.
Those calculations IMO are way off but.
The GST, Customs cost, Airfreight and handling charges (airfreight or sea freight) all need to be exact otherwise it's a wild guess. And the original assumption of what a USA Dealer pays Stern could also be way off.
I have been told exact figures from both an Aust Dealer and a USA Dealer but the whole "how much are they making profit" has been done before and it's always the same and ends up being a total guess fest.
All I can say is, is that I like to ask the current BEST Cash pricing, and then negotiate on coin mechs or delivery or shakers etc.
Other than that, there is no point in worrying about who makes what. Everyone has to eat and every business has to make a healthy profit to survive.
The only true variable in the whole chain is customs duty. Smart businesses minimise this by reducing the cost of the product coming into the country - then they have a deal for royalties etc back to the manufacturer. That's why, if anything, a $3,250 cost to the distributor is too high. The other figures are set from there. The only qn is how much of the price gouge goes to AMD & how much to Stern. As you say only they know that.
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If you can find a currency Pro at $5500 USA given our 80 cents trading figure compared to the USA $.
5500 adds 1100 with dollar difference is now $6600 Aust
Now add 10 percent gst to Aust is $6600 plus $660 is $7240 Aust
Then add import duties n customs to Australia and u are going to get high 7,s to just under 8 grand Aussie for a BNIB Pro.
Sounds roughly right using some quick calculations in my head.
Negotiate delivery n shaker and u are a happy camper.
So, dealers pay the retail price?
Here's one roughly calculated alternative: Dealer cost US $3,250. Add shipping US $350 = US $3,600. Add customs & GST = US $4,140. In $Aud terms this is $5,175 into the country. Sell Price $7,950 (incl. additional GST approx $200). In this one example markup exceeds $2,600 from which the distrib. then needs to deduct local expenses to determine profit.
Those calculations IMO are way off but.
The GST, Customs cost, Airfreight and handling charges (airfreight or sea freight) all need to be exact otherwise it's a wild guess. And the original assumption of what a USA Dealer pays Stern could also be way off.
I have been told exact figures from both an Aust Dealer and a USA Dealer but the whole "how much are they making profit" has been done before and it's always the same and ends up being a total guess fest.
All I can say is, is that I like to ask the current BEST Cash pricing, and then negotiate on coin mechs or delivery or shakers etc.
Other than that, there is no point in worrying about who makes what. Everyone has to eat and every business has to make a healthy profit to survive.
The only true variable in the whole chain is customs duty. Smart businesses minimise this by reducing the cost of the product coming into the country - then they have a deal for royalties etc back to the manufacturer. That's why, if anything, a $3,250 cost to the distributor is too high. The other figures are set from there. The only qn is how much of the price gouge goes to AMD & how much to Stern. As you say only they know that.
No customs duty on coin operated machines. There is a tariff for this exact exemption. New or second hand. If it were applicable, it would be 10-15% maximum. Bottom line - if anyone claims Duty on imports and passes that on to consumers, they are either lying, or have never imported before.
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Re Ninos last post, What happens if the entire container has BNIB pins and none are fitted with coin mechs etc.
Do they/don't they charge customs etc.
I have imported stuff without coin mechs and it's been too long to look at/find the paperwork or remember the breakdowns.
Also, imagine what's been on that real tounge for the last 40 years ? Now it has balls rolling over it as well !
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If you can find a currency Pro at $5500 USA given our 80 cents trading figure compared to the USA $.
5500 adds 1100 with dollar difference is now $6600 Aust
Now add 10 percent gst to Aust is $6600 plus $660 is $7240 Aust
Then add import duties n customs to Australia and u are going to get high 7,s to just under 8 grand Aussie for a BNIB Pro.
Sounds roughly right using some quick calculations in my head.
Negotiate delivery n shaker and u are a happy camper.
So, dealers pay the retail price?
Here's one roughly calculated alternative: Dealer cost US $3,250. Add shipping US $350 = US $3,600. Add customs & GST = US $4,140. In $Aud terms this is $5,175 into the country. Sell Price $7,950 (incl. additional GST approx $200). In this one example markup exceeds $2,600 from which the distrib. then needs to deduct local expenses to determine profit.
Those calculations IMO are way off but.
The GST, Customs cost, Airfreight and handling charges (airfreight or sea freight) all need to be exact otherwise it's a wild guess. And the original assumption of what a USA Dealer pays Stern could also be way off.
I have been told exact figures from both an Aust Dealer and a USA Dealer but the whole "how much are they making profit" has been done before and it's always the same and ends up being a total guess fest.
All I can say is, is that I like to ask the current BEST Cash pricing, and then negotiate on coin mechs or delivery or shakers etc.
Other than that, there is no point in worrying about who makes what. Everyone has to eat and every business has to make a healthy profit to survive.
The only true variable in the whole chain is customs duty. Smart businesses minimise this by reducing the cost of the product coming into the country - then they have a deal for royalties etc back to the manufacturer. That's why, if anything, a $3,250 cost to the distributor is too high. The other figures are set from there. The only qn is how much of the price gouge goes to AMD & how much to Stern. As you say only they know that.
No customs duty on coin operated machines. There is a tariff for this exact exemption. New or second hand. If it were applicable, it would be 10-15% maximum. Bottom line - if anyone claims Duty on imports and passes that on to consumers, they are either lying, or have never imported before.
Well that helps a lot. Guitars are 5% new or second hand (assuming over $1k which all Gibsons are) applicable to cost incl shipping (plus 10% GST of course). Thank God pins have something working in their favour price-wise.
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What happens if the entire container has BNIB pins and none are fitted with coin mechs etc.
Do they/don't they charge customs etc.
I have imported stuff without coin mechs and it's been too long to look at/find the paperwork or remember the breakdowns.
The intended use for an amusement machine is create income. All pinballs are "Coin Operated". They can have ticket validators / dispensors or be set to "free play" - it makes absolutely no difference to customs.
If the container is full of NIB pinballs without coin acceptors, it will make no difference. If the machines don't have doors to mount the acceptors then the games would be deemed "spare parts" - but their intended use IS/WAS to create income via a coin acceptor - so therefore the tariff applies. Between my father and I, we have imported 100's of games, and NEVER paid Duty (in accordance with the regulations at the time) as the tariff applied in all cases. In fact, in the 70's, machines were shipped to Australia with USA coin acceptors, or NONE.
Ironically, my Father was the person who told me about the tariff - so it has been around for a long time.
If ANY importer of ANY pinball is claiming they pay Duty, then they are one of two things;
1 - A liar
2 - Are in need of a Freight forwarder / customs agent that knows what a tariff is
So the next time ANYONE mentions "we had to pay customs, GST and DUTY" - - Then immediately deduct 10% from the asking price as they are either lying, or should pay for the duty due to their incompetence.
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Good info Nino. The customs duty for pinballs is in fact 5 per cent (Chapter 95, Schedule 3) but as you note (amazingly) there is a tariff concession that negates it.
9504.30 PINBALL MACHINES - Coin Operated
Op. 22.02.1988 Dec. 25.05.1989 - TC 8802725
Still have to pay gst of course - but the 5% would have a discernible impact - especially as you would pay the 5% duty & then gst on the value INCLUDING that duty. The industry must have had a bloody good lobby group at some stage.
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here is a good link for costs of importing:
http://www.customs.gov.au/site/page4368.asp#ImportEntryCosts
Australia has a free trade agreement with the US so if you clearly states on the invoice and possibly the box that the product is US made it gets rid of a Duty's Tax for Aussies
from what I understand from US to Aus over $1000 and from personal experience of importing my first pin (mid 2010) before knowing about pin forums etc - and being very naive. I am sure when guys bring in a container and have their owner freight forwarders there are costs to be saved. I got burnt big time and could not be bothered in the future. This is what I copped so maybe learn from my mistake.
Game and Freight
- cost of game
- cost of freight (sea for me)
- freight insurance (about $3.50 per $100) - optional
Aus Port
- Aus Port Charges (% based on the volume of the crate - mine was $115 cubic metre)
- Terminal Handling Charge (% based on the volume of the crate - mine was $28 cubic metre)
- Delivery Order Fee (set fee)
- Sea Cargo Compliance Fee (set fee)
- CMR Compliance Fee (set fee)
- Import Processing Fee (set fee)
- Handling Fee (set fee)
- Terminal Security Fee (set fee)
Aus Broker
- Duty, GST & Customs - variable based on the Aus value of machine and freight - which included a gambling tax (coin operated mech)
- Quarantine Charges
- Aqis CMR Compliance Fee (set fee of approx $28)
- ACS CMR compliance Fee (set fee of approx $28)
- Cartage LCL
- Fuel Surcharge on Cartage
- Quaratine Attendance
- Agency Attendance (set fee of approx $165)
hope that helps
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The ironic thing when you cut out the freight forwarder, is that 75 percent of all the $ charges dissapear.
When I imported arcade stuff from the USA via Seafreight, with the advice of my brother who had worked in freight forwarding for many years, a lot of the so called mandatory charges and fees become free exemptions if you do a "self import".
Customs House in any large city or capital usually can provide all the info on what to do and what not to do.
If the person overseas who is sending you your freight doesn't have all the correct paperwork in order, then no matter what you do here, u are screwed $ if u cannot provide what the system demands upon arrival and clearance.
If u do your homework, and self import you can save a bundle.
You can also use a experienced and efficient freight forwarder, but they are like 2nd hand car sales yards, you really have to shop around to avoid the shonks.
Buying from AMD at a set price is stress free. And the machine will work here straight away with warranty etc.
The rules and red tape with importing changes all the time. It's not a headache free exercise.
Done it before very successfully, but wouldn't do it again. The savings are minimal these days and it's just not worth the hassle on BNIB machines.
2nd hand stuff, different story IF u have the time and desire.
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I would really like some assistance on importing 5 EM's from the states. Was hoping that someone may have plans for a container in the near future with some extra space available.
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I would really like some assistance on importing 5 EM's from the states. Was hoping that someone may have plans for a container in the near future with some extra space available.
not sure where you are based but there is one option - a guy on the Central Coast that packs his own containers in LA to Central Coast NSW and you can pay a set fee per machine.
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Thanks for the reply Swinks. Is this the same bloke that advertises on eBay from time to time?
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I would really like some assistance on importing 5 EM's from the states. Was hoping that someone may have plans for a container in the near future with some extra space available.
Yet another thing for consideration is that "used" anything coming to Australia (as opposed to "new" items) attract a whole lot more interest from AQIS.
There is a much higher chance they will want a container unpacked at the wharf for closer inspection thus adding many hundreds and sometimes thousands of dollars to the import cost.
I will not allow anyone to share my containers unless the goods are delivered to my factory so we can inspect them personally and take things from there (after learning this the hard and expensive way many years ago) BUT we are sending new goods only - your used machines would very likely go with other used machines but it is worth keeping in mind if you are asking others to share a container - it just isn't that simple.
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Thanks for the reply Swinks. Is this the same bloke that advertises on eBay from time to time?
yes it is