Replica pinball machines

[solar value]

Evening members and guests,

Here's something I was thinking about in the shower this morning:

What would it take to build a replica of an already existing title? Let's take an example that is often used in these hypothetical scenarios: Fathom. A popular title, in demand, and for which a heap of repro parts have already been made.

Now, assuming that it was possible to convince all the people who have made reproduction parts for this game to do another run for a new project. Let's list the parts which have already been made:

backglass (CPR)
playfield (CPR)
plastics (CPR)
cabinet (doug huse)
cabinet stencils (pinball pal)
coin door skin
boards
pop bumper caps
drop targets
All the generic playfield parts (posts, pop bumper assemblies, flippers, rubbers, etc.)
coil assembles
coils

What is left? (i.e. what would have to be re-manufactured?) I can think of a few things to get the list started:

transformer
looms (but we have the parts, right?)
legs
metal playfield hardware (guides, etc.)
drop target assemblies
apron
coin door assemblies

What if someone were to start a company which sourced all the existing parts from those people that had reproduced them and organised to have the remaining parts made. They could then offer a replica pinball in a kit form, flat-packed. A video/manual accompanies the kit which shows the assembly process and maybe with a USB stick with diagrams, step-by step photos, paint reference numbers for the cabinet, etc. The buyer assembles it himself, spraying the cabinet with the supplied stencils, etc. etc.

I was thinking that the market for most of the repro manufacturers is not limited by demand but by the remaining (small) number of original games out in the world which people can put the repro parts into. This way the market is potentially much larger. It kind of seems a shame that so many reproduction parts can exist for a game and yet we can't just finish it off and do the whole thing.

I know there has already been discussion of remakes along the lines of King of Diamonds, but what about a game like this where a lot of the repro parts have been made already and where you get the customer to do the assembly?

Anyways, maybe people want to add to the list of parts needed (or parts currently available) and continue the discussion with ideas, problems and opinions...

SV.

[swinks]

It would be cool if you could buy kits as it would be the next type of challenge for a lot of guys but there would be licensing issues which hand brakes this sort of thing.

Even the Kings of Diamonds is licensed, and sadly made in China with the first 100 going back to the USA to be checked and tweaked and then sent out to customers with the the next batch despatched straight from China to the various destinations.

Here is a good resource for fathom
http://www.pinball.yoo-design.com/

[pinsanity]

A guy in the US built a MM from all the repro parts that have been remade to date, including getting the lane guides and metal ramps custom made and the wiring loom remade.

Now admittedly this was a one off where he paid retail prices for repro parts, but I think he said it ended up costing him $12,000 all up.

All those little bits and pieces start to add up and unless you are running off a few thousand of those widgets to keep costs down I'm not sure how viable it would be.

[solar value]

but there would be licensing issues which hand brakes this sort of thing.

Yes, but presumably CPR managed to sort out the licensing issues when they did the playfields, backglasses, etc. so it couldn't be too hard.

A guy in the US built a MM from all the repro parts that have been remade to date, including getting the lane guides and metal ramps custom made and the wiring loom remade.

Great! So it's possible at least.

I think he said it ended up costing him $12,000 all up.

I've been reading on RGP that used MMs are going for a lot more than that in the US lately, up to and beyond $15000. Anyways, we'd be aiming to make a lot of these, at least 1000, so that should keep costs down.

[Homepin]

but there would be licensing issues which hand brakes this sort of thing.

Yes, but presumably CPR managed to sort out the licensing issues when they did the playfields, backglasses, etc. so it couldn't be too hard.

A guy in the US built a MM from all the repro parts that have been remade to date, including getting the lane guides and metal ramps custom made and the wiring loom remade.

Great! So it's possible at least.

I think he said it ended up costing him $12,000 all up.

I've been reading on RGP that used MMs are going for a lot more than that in the US lately, up to and beyond $15000. Anyways, we'd be aiming to make a lot of these, at least 1000, so that should keep costs down.

Define "too hard" ???????

I have been down this track for several years now and you simply wouldn't believe the brick walls you come up against...

I am closer than ever to doing something in kit form however.

Stern machines are 80% (my guess) built in China - certainly all of the electronics are - so you had better get over that issue first as mine will be 95% built in China.

I have the factory space already assigned but there are many many many MANY other issues..............

[Retropin]

Aaah China.. China.

First thing you need to know about getting anything in China is that it aint all bad.
Problem with sourcing parts/ having manufacturing done is that us westerners get real tight and want something for nothing. There are plenty of really good manufacturers in China that make products of the best calibre youll ever see.. but you get what you pay for.
To understand China and know who to approach, you need to meet, see factories and talk... Mike is in a perfect position to do this having immersed himself there already, he above anyone else on this forum understands how the place works and can sort the good from the bad.

My LED products come from China.. i put 12 month warranty on all of them. Some factories are good for ribbon strip, some good for aluminium, some good for module.. i could not find one supplier that could do all of them at the quality i required. I am part of a very small market that offers warranty.. even the big electrical wholesalers do not offer warranty on LED... know your product... know your source and stand behind them.

You want to make a pinball machine that is affordable??? Then it will not be made in a western country.. costs would be huge.. the Chinese are the cleverest and most business hungry people i have ever met... if they dont make it now.. they will and can for you, no problems.
Im trying to get a sheet of glass replaced in a shopping centre at the moment... 2 companies have failed to turn up to even scope the job.. reason??
" it just sounded a bit complicated for us mate.. sorry for letting you down".. this is after i had a confirmed meeting after explaining the job.

F@#king hell.. i dont think the Chinese understand what a too hard basket is... seems to me everyone else carries one at all times.
And with that attitude.. the Chinese will take over your world.. so yes.. to repeat Mike... better get over it

[Pinballesquire]

I agree, Chinese are very hard working and almost impossible to compete against in terms of labour price. I lived in China for a while and the scale of what that sort of population manpower can accomplish is staggering. Lots of pitfalls to avoid in the market, but properly sourced, Chinese manufacturing is where it's at.

[ajlaird]

You are very hard pressed to find something in the computer world that is NOT made in China these days.