neons

[pinball god]

My swep1 neon hasn't been working for some time now. Replaced the driver pcb and neon transformer and it still was unstable in that it might work, might not. Then eventually it stopped working until yesterday for maybe 2 minutes. Is there a real chance the fault is the neon or not? Unsure how to test this problem.

[pinsanity]

Process of elimination to test.

Is the neon transformer in SW the same as a CV?





PLEASE be careful doing this, there are a lot of volts coming out of those PINK leads which will give you a fair old jolt if you touch them!!!!!!!

Remove the neon and the transformer from the machine and hook up the red and black leads to a regular 9v rectangular battery.

If the neon doesn't light up, the problem is the transformer or the neon.

If it lights up, the problem lies in the machine. (My neon fault with my CV was a partially fried ULN2803 chip, so maybe once you have eliminated the neon and transformer from the equation start your investigation here).

Like so -----

[pinball god]

same transformer that I installed. Pity the battery is out of shot as it would have given me a good clue on hook up. Can I just disconnect the two pin plug in the machine and run connect some wires to the battery and plug?

And just checking but connecting to the battery, are the voltages still high coming from the pink wires? thanks

[pinsanity]

I updated the photo for a better one - refresh the page pg.

Red - positive
Black - negative

As soon as you hook it up to the battery there is current running through the higher voltage pink wires. Yes you can just disconnect the two pin plug and run some connect wires as an alternative.

Hold the wires down on the battery with your fingers as you are only testing for a matter of seconds and that way if you accidently get zapped with the larger current running through the pink wires, there's a good chance you will break the circuit automatically.

[pinsanity]

Curse this 5 minute time limit post editing software.  

Also with a DMM check the two pin plug going into the machine with the machine turned on and see if you have ~12v coming out of it.

[pinball god]

did the battery test and it lights up. did the dmm and get 14.22vdc

Now I have 2 x driver pcb's and did a swap to the current one and the problem came back within a week or two. So if the chip is fried, what could be causing it?

Also as a side note, yesterday the neon did come on again for a minute or two. Since I have had this game the neon has been a bit suspect. I would have to turn the game on and off a few times to get it to work. Hope this info helps a little

[pinsanity]

So if the chip is fried, what could be causing it?

Also as a side note, yesterday the neon did come on again for a minute or two. Since I have had this game the neon has been a bit suspect. I would have to turn the game on and off a few times to get it to work. Hope this info helps a little

Typically an unexpected current surge onto the PCB ruins the 2803 chip. Something touching or grounding on the underside of the playfield that shouldn't be perhaps (solenoid to switch) or done while working on the machine with it switched on?

The fact the problem has come back after a week even with a new PCB installed would indicate there is no point replacing the chip until the grounding cause is located (if indeed the chip is the problem)


So in the neon test under the test menu, the neon does nothing?

[pinball god]

pin2000 has no neon test in diagnostics 

[pinball god]

another piece of info I have. By accident in the past I found when closing the coin door sometimes abruptly, or slamming it a little would bring the neon to life. Do you think the grounding more than like is somewhere there? much appreciate your patience and help

[pinsanity]

Disconnect the coin door I guess (remove from equation) and see if any changes?

For the CV, I had to visually search all over the underside of the playfield until I found a coil wire that was touching against a switch. Fixed it, changed the 2803 chip on the pcb and the neon was back on straight away.

Could be a case of looking for a needle in a haystack, I'm afraid.....

[pinball god]

Disconnect the coin door I guess (remove from equation) and see if any changes?

For the CV, I had to visually search all over the underside of the playfield until I found a coil wire that was touching against a switch. Fixed it, changed the 2803 chip on the pcb and the neon was back on straight away.

Could be a case of looking for a needle in a haystack, I'm afraid.....

thanks mate

[Retropin]

Agree here.. it sounds like you have lost ground somewhere... what you could do is get your DMM and put this onto true ground from mains input and then test the voltage across the earth on the driver transistor... the voltage you read will give you a clue as to where to start looking

[pinball god]

Agree here.. it sounds like you have lost ground somewhere... what you could do is get your DMM and put this onto true ground from mains input and then test the voltage across the earth on the driver transistor... the voltage you read will give you a clue as to where to start looking

yep gav.........what the    what I'm picturing in my head I think is nothing like what you're saying. Sorry could you elaborate? At the moment I'm thinking I have to connect the earth of either the power point or earth pin of the power plug and then find out where the earth is on a transistor on the driver pcb

[pinball god]

something interesting to report. I found under solenoid test, the neon test. I chose it to repeat but also needed to manually activate the door interlock switch. When I did this, a few controlled lights flicked on, did it again and some other lights flicked on briefly. I thought I found a lamp that was ascrew in its holder and replaced the bulb. The neon strobed during the test. Put the game back together and no go. Did the test again and got lights flicker on for a millisecond.

Too tired to have another look but now convinced something is shorting. Could it be the actual  holder eventhough the light works? It was a GI lamp by the way.

[pinball god]

haven't progressed any further than I can get the neon working with a battery, there's 14vdc to the connector, when testing the neon in diagnostics I sometimes see various random lights quickly flick on then off, but have not been able to make the neon pulse on.

Did lots of visuals and replaced dead bulbs but I think I'll have to give up for the moment again as its done my head in way too much this time. thanks for all your help.

At least I know I don't have to replace the neon or transformer. thanks again