Which One - NOS or NEW Ramps?

[Pintoxicated]

I've been trying to weigh it up and was just wondering what the general consensus was - NOS or NEW ramps?

[Pop Bumper Pete]

Me, I would go for new

as somebody else has posted, NOS ramps are already 12-18 years old
Greg (RTBB) has said that the ramps he sells are made from better plastics

So if it has been reproduced, I would go for new

[ktm450]

Definately new, they are made to better standards and are much thicker, also guaranteed not to crack for 12 months by Greg.
But not every ramp is available new so sometimes you have to settle for NOS

[pinnies4me]

Definately new, they are made to better standards and are much thicker, also guaranteed not to crack for 12 months by Greg.
But not every ramp is available new so sometimes you have to settle for NOS

+1. Added greg's ramps to FH and they are a different creature quality wise is every way. Also got some new AFM ones (haven't fitted them yet, gotta get off my a$$ one of these days and do it) but you can see the difference at a glance. NOS is great for non-reproed ones, but I would go repro in an instant if there's a choice.

[Caveoftreasures]

whatever is available for the best price.

there is nothing wrong with NOS ramps, afterall, we have all been using them, dont forget, on EVERY pinball machine we have all owned since day 1 with its original ramps.

home use machines dont get much use, and also, every NOS ramp I have purchased so far from Mark C for example, has been less than half price compared to the competition, pushing new ramps at double n triple the cost.

ALL the NOS ramps I have purchased have been perfect, they look like the day they were made, and are still as tough as nails.

people flogging new ramps have to say something negative about NOS stock or they wouldnt make a dime flogging new ones.
NOS is fine. Just look at your current machines which all carry the orig ramps. Except for wear that is due to massive commercial on site usage, all ramps are still as tough as nails and look great. The ramp deals being offered right now for NOS stock, has never been so dam good. Save money, buy the NOS. 

[Pinfan]

New all the way !

Some NOS ramps can be up to 20 years old and even without noticing have slightly yellowed and a great deal thinner and inferior than repro ramps....

Most plastics turn brittle with age. I have purchased 6 ramps from Greg, all repro/new, and all have been superior to the originals. Thicker stronger and weak points have been rectified....

If its new and available i suggest you visit RTBB...

[pinnies4me]

Save money, buy the NOS. 

Sure, if the price is important and there's a supply of NOS, go for it. I'm not going to post like I think I'm an expert, but my experience with the NOS v Repro falls squarely to the Repros.

[Pinballace]

Sorry if some of this is a repeat of a previous thread but since it pertains directly to the question asked it bears repeating.

Being an expert on the subject, it's real simple.  Plastic is petrol based and dries out over time, can’t avoid it, that’s the facts.  The reason we got into making ramps, eight years ago I bought an NOS TAF ramp (which came from IPB) for $530, within 6 days it was busted.  That ramp was just over 10 years old when I bought it.

The original ramps installed in machines usually have a much better lifespan than stored NOS as they are installed on a machine which is usually kept in a controlled environment but as most will note, the main reason they need to be replaced is they have cracked, hazed or at worse been busted to the point of rendering the machine unplayable (which was the case from a recent Strange Science customer).  Our research showed the main cause of ramp breaks and cracks was a result of the plastic drying out and becoming brittle.  

We "flame" polish every ramp to take out small scratches caused by the production process.  Flaming the plastic slightly melts the top surface and makes a smooth clear finish.  The reason some NOS ramps which are 10 years old or much older which are scratched or hazed cannot be flamed out is the plastic is too old and has dried up.  The life of those dried NOS ramps are minimal as the steel ball hitting dried brittle plastic...well the steel ball will win and the NOS ramp will eventually be toast.  

There are some who insist on only NOS.  It’s all about preference and if NOS is your choice then good on ya.  Right now not all ramps are available new (but the list is continuing to grow) so sometimes NOS is the only choice.  Not all NOS ramps are brittle to the point of cracking at anytime, some may have been stored well and still have some moisture left.  The easy way to tell is to try and flame polish the surface.  If it doesn't take out scratches then the ramp is dried up and you may want to steer clear.

Regardless of your choice, 10 years ago NOS ramps were going for $400+.  When we started making replacements the NOS market tanked and now there are cost effective choices for those who want either new or NOS.  The good part about new ramps is the source continues to replenish and expand whereas NOS will eventually dry up (no pun intended).

[ktm450]

people flogging new ramps have to say something negative about NOS stock or they wouldnt make a dime flogging new ones.

I have no financial intrest either way, but would always go for a better product if I could afford it, for not much more (sometimes less) than NOS I can have a brand new, much thicker, better product.

Just look at your current machines which all carry the orig ramps. Except for wear that is due to massive commercial on site usage, all ramps are still as tough as nails and look great.

Not true, check out most games and by now they will have cracked ramps, even those with minimal use, there are games such as WH20 where the 2 ramps beside the 'no way out' entrance are so thin at the exposed ends that on all games they are totally trashed, I have not seen one, or heard of one that isn't.  I needed to replace both. There is no way I would waste my time putting originals back in there, they are a pain in the ass to change anyway for them to break again in a few years, few weeks, few days??? who knows?
The new ramps are so much thicker that I am confident they will never break, I do not have ramp protectors on the and am totally satisfied with my purchase.

Have you actually seen one of these new ramps?

Before you state that people are trying to 'flog' them maybe you should have a look at one and see for yourself.
I have never seen Greg on any forum trying to "flog" his ramps or stating anything negative about anything. They sell themselves.

[Caveoftreasures]

Isnt it great we all have choices. NOS or Brand New. Each to their own.

Of my 30 machines, I have one only original ramp on my Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles ramp which has cracks on the entrance. All the other machines, I have inspected closely and are all fine. I feel anyone saying that generally, that NOS ramps are all leading towards being at the end of their life is simply not true.

Other than the condition of my 30 machines, and the excellent ramps on all of them, I recently bought the following NOS ramps, all were in excellent condition.

NOS star wars episode 1 - 4 x different types - all perfect
NOS dirty harry - perfect
NOS star trek next gen - different types-all perfect
NOS No Fear - 2 x different ramps
and a few others I have forgotten the names on, all via ebay or psp
I bought these ramps for spares, and I was glad i saved a heap on them. Also, not all ramps are available new. Mark C had bugs bunny ramps, and i needed spares, that was a dam good find. I was glad to have got those NOS.

Brand new ramps, and the work RTBB are doing is excellent. Brand new is brand new.  

But some people, new, old or otherwise, should also know, that not all NOS stock is faulty, or even close to it. and yes, i have seen the RTBB ramps, they are perfect, but so are 90 percent of the NOS ramps i have unboxed, and saved a heap.$

As i said at the start, Brand new, or NOS, we all have choices,each to their own, and thats the best thing for all pinballers.  
Also, these posts are just our opinions, and just because we have different opinions, doesnt mean we all cant still get along. Thats the thing about a healthy debate, thats all it is, its just a debate.  

[Pintoxicated]

Thanks for the input everyone.

[shansta]

Go the younger option:

Plastic parts shrink over time (even in an controlled environment) - this as well as the chemical changes that James pointed out earlier, will ensure that the plastic will stress and crack over time.

By the time you can see stress cracks with the naked eye - it's all over by then!

Plastic products do not live forever as greenpeace would have you believe, UV light, humidity and heat are all catalysts - and cause the structure of the plastic to change at a molecular level... (This is important because the molecules have to be in "alignment" to give plastic it's strength and clarity/transparentness)

I'm not a salesman for RTBB/PBL either... 

[ddstoys]

i like the bit about green peace (f**kin wankers) 

   I cleaned out my grandfathers shed and these plastic shopping pags that ever break down literally turned to dust when i touched them and they only live in that house for a maximum of ten years

  Only green peace message i ever agreed with was

Save a Whale harpoon a fat chick.......

Hang on was that save a mouse eat a Pu**y?????


    No no Sorry  i was thinking of my motto if it moves shoot it if it doesnt cut it down 

PINBALL RAMPS ARE ALL GOOD ASLONG AS THEY DONT HAVE DIRTY CRACKS

(Sorry one to many Johnys i think LMFAO)

[shansta]

Yeah - your clothes pegs would be made out of the cheapest brand of plastic they could find... (15-20 years ago there was some real shit-nasty raw plastic coming out of India, China and the like...)

Coloring the stuff is a real problem too - any plastic is strongest in it's raw, virgin form.

You add cheap shit masterbatch (color) to your mix - it does that horrible molecular thing mentioned earlier...


Guess this would apply to pins as well - we know a LOT more about plastic nowadays, then 30 years ago!

James would know - but I am sure he could make parts out of endless brands & grades of material.

20-30 years ago - there were not that many players in the market to buy from.


I make headlights out of Lexan LS111 - that is one grade out of 20 that G.E. sell in Australia (Of clear Polycarbonate)

CD's/DVD's are the same material - but a different grade.

Laserlight roofing is the same again (they buy our scrap to recycle)...


Sorry for the hijack Pintoxicated! I will get off the soapbox now! 

[Caveoftreasures]

I honestly wish u guys could have been at my place this afternoon when i opened up the boxes of NOS ramps I got from PSP.

Beaky (Andrew) was with me and we discussed the NEW vs NOS thing , as well as the post I am writing on now etc, and I went over every inch of each of the seven or more ramps I unboxed. Everyone of them was absolutely perfect, none were brittle, none had even a spec of dust on them, and they had obviously been stored well for many years. Each ramp was thick, shiny looking, crystal clear,with no thin spots etc, and honestly, they looked like they had just come off the production line, gleaming.

I know what u mean about some ramps being made originally thin. Not one of these was like that, but one of the ramps on my bugs bunny pinball were friggin thin n crappy from day one. The rest were friggin excellent. I wish u guys could have seen just how dam good these NOS ones really were. Plenty of flex, no brittle etc. I was even surprised with just how dam good they were. Dont give up on NOS just yet.