My Opinion on Pinball Importers.

[RottyGuy]

Its also only good for the moment its tagged.
Could well develope a fault 2 seconds later

I wish i had a dollar for everytime i've heard this from other trades on job sites trying to justify to me how test/tag is a waste of time.

[The pinballist formally known as Dean Morgan]

What about earthing of old machines? DMD machines have earth straps to all metal components such as coin door and legs etc.  Most EMs do not. Many old EMs have 240v to coin door start relay and coin mech contact and only fish paper between live contact and door or start button etc.  So should sellers be having earthing cables installed to all these areas? I would think so.  I'm an A grade sparky by trade, but no longer work as one.  I have seen a lot of dangerous things done to pins, including numerous over the years were the earth pin on the plug is not even connected.

[Olivia_jason]

 

[Ant68]

What about earthing of old machines? DMD machines have earth straps to all metal components such as coin door and legs etc.  Most EMs do not. Many old EMs have 240v to coin door start relay and coin mech contact and only fish paper between live contact and door or start button etc.  So should sellers be having earthing cables installed to all these areas? I would think so.  I'm an A grade sparky by trade, but no longer work as one.  I have seen a lot of dangerous things done to pins, including numerous over the years were the earth pin on the plug is not even connected.

Good point , running a braided earth straps in EM would be the best idea , it would bring them up to speed.
What's your thoughts Gavin/ Nino
 

[Retropin]

I wish i had a dollar for everytime i've heard this from other trades on job sites trying to justify to me how test/tag is a waste of time

Agreed, but i do T&T and in all honesty, unless you are testing every day, you can only certtify it was fine at time of testing...

..another scenario for you.. i test something in May and its fine.. has been used on and off for 6 months.. i test again in Nov and it fails... when did it develope the fault?

Good point , running a braided earth straps in EM would be the best idea , it would bring them up to speed.
What's your thoughts Gavin/ Nino

I ALWAYS add extra earth to EM games i own.. mainly to the transformer when i replace twin cable with 3 core and then to coin door etc. The legs are isolated so no need to earth off, but if wiring especially the ( now) 240V runs against metal it gets earthed.
GTB coin doors are a MUST

[Retropin]

Just to add.. i had 1 machine come through my hands that was lethal. I was repairing it for someone else and ended up buying it.
But when i got it, you would get a shock from the door and lockdown bar.. it was mains voltage.
Now this game came from a very well known dealer fully working and overhauled. The leaf switches on the door had been altered so coin switch would activate just before the start button.. so in essence, the two switches had been combined.
Game was a 60's WMS machine and these have mains through the loom behind the door also... wiring on one side of the AC cycle had worn through and caused the door and any subsequent metal attached to be live with half AC cycle.

Its important to earth and have trip switches installed... all my machine to machine cabling is on RCD devices... and then further up the line i have the main earth trip. Thats 2 RCD devices just in case 1 decides not to work

[Strangeways]

What about earthing of old machines? DMD machines have earth straps to all metal components such as coin door and legs etc.  Most EMs do not. Many old EMs have 240v to coin door start relay and coin mech contact and only fish paper between live contact and door or start button etc.  So should sellers be having earthing cables installed to all these areas? I would think so.  I'm an A grade sparky by trade, but no longer work as one.  I have seen a lot of dangerous things done to pins, including numerous over the years were the earth pin on the plug is not even connected.

Good point , running a braided earth straps in EM would be the best idea , it would bring them up to speed.
What's your thoughts Gavin/ Nino
 

I always install an earth wire to the mains transformer and a jumper from the earth to the cabinet braid. As soon as I start an EM, the first thing I do remove the old cord and replace it with a new 3 prong terminal. Many overseas games don't have earth, so they need to be checked.

[Extra Ball]

Royal Flush I am restoring is from france, and never had an earth to the mains.

[ddstoys]

Worst I've seen was a machine tripping the safety switch.  Someone had replaced the mains plug and wired the active to the earth lucky they had safety switches

[wonder]

I think it the lack quality that is being imported now.Just piles of crap for the first buyer to get burned on.

[MartyJ]

I think it the lack quality that is being imported now.Just piles of crap for the first buyer to get burned on.

Agreed.

But the eBay dealers only want profit and even average machines can be recovered.  All comes down to skill and cutting corners to make the most amount of profit possible.

[Olivia_jason]

 

[Caveoftreasures]

There are still literally thousands upon thousands of machines still in Europe.
I get sent photos and wholesale prices every week, and have done for apx 4 years or more from various sellers.

It will be a while yet before machines dry up from various European countries....u can still buy A, B, C, D titles in dmd. You just have to pay a bit more for the best quality of any A thru to D title to get a really clean machine.  You can double your money easily and still sell everything as a project untouched if u want to wipe over, check over, list what each machine needs, and price accordingly. People who import to their own garage or own house make the most. People with staff n overheads still make money, but have to be picky as to what they shop out, or just sell as a project.

[Strangeways]

I think it the lack quality that is being imported now.Just piles of crap for the first buyer to get burned on.

Agreed.

But the eBay dealers only want profit and even average machines can be recovered.  All comes down to skill and cutting corners to make the most amount of profit possible.

Absolutely correct Marty !

The quality has not changed that much, just the "A" list game prices have gone through the roof - especially to Australia. This is mainly because there are so many importers. Demand is high, so suppliers increase their prices. A container pin is still a container pin. The skill of the tech or restorer determines the end product. It is a fact that some importers have a "cap" on what they are prepared to spend on parts and more importantly - a "cap" on the amount of hours spent. This should not be a predetermined figure. No two games are in exactly the same condition. Anyone who claims that they spend 20-25 hours on a "reconditioned" game is simply cutting corners. This is a deliberate ploy to ensure service calls in the immediate future. As I previously mentioned, profits are protected as the expense of the customer. Newbies have targets on the foreheads, and the first place newbies look is eBay.

how much has come down to the fact the quality of pins from over seas is starting to dry up and is a case of supply and demand?

Pins overseas are not drying up. Just think back to the mercy dash a dealer made 6-7 years ago to secure the last remaining pinballs in the world. I think in the last 3 weeks I've been offered over 100 machines.

[Olivia_jason]