Start Up problem with Kings & Queens

[mark jackson]

I was playing Kings & Queens (Gottlieb 1965) ok today when suddenly ..... on start up, the big relay bank underside of playfield (where reset relay is) keeps repeatedly activating. The scorereels are all at 0, but the ball release has not been activated and the score motor goes round and round..... Any help here?? It was just fine, ...and then it wasn't.
I should also mention that prior to this the Units reel was occassionally running past its Zero Postion on start-up. Please help if u can.

[oldpins]

I'd be looking closely at the score reel/s contacts. Sounds like a full reset is not happening. Starting with the one which is running over as mentioned.

[goodolddays]

I'd be looking closely at the score reel/s contacts. Sounds like a full reset is not happening. Starting with the one which is running over as mentioned.

+1 .. more than likely a score reel switch issue by the sound of it

[mark jackson]

Hi guys, Thanks for getting back.  ..... This morning I did the following:
1. Took off the tin score-reel (Units), checked the contacts for '0' and '9'. Cleaned contacts. Adjusted the 'brake' via the Allen screw at rear of counter frame, so that the counter does not run past the rest position at Zero.  .... Tested the macine with the same result as yesterday.
2. Cleaned and checked all contacts on the re-set relay (found on the big relay bank on underside of playfield). ..... tested and the same result.
3. Checked and cleaned all contacts on the start relay (found on the main relay bnk on the motor board.) I paid careful attention to that special contact (on Start relay) which only opens when relay is completely latched. All contacts seem to be functioning correctly. Tesed the machine with the same result as yesterday.

Again, all score-reels went back to Zero, but the big coil on the relay bank (underside of playfield) keeps repeatedly pulling in and game will not rest as in the start of a new game.
.......... My Hank De Yaeger Pinball repair book does not say anything much about a problem such as I've described. All help to track this one down is appreciated.  ............ Thanks, Mark
....Weren't the SYDNEY SWANS great last night. Well done team.

[Freiherr]

Could it be a constantly activated score relay somewhere on your playfield?

Check all targets, rollovers, pop bumpers, kickout holes, spinners, kickers or any other switches where applicable. There is a possibility that a switch is stuck closed.

It is worthwhile to check, you never know.

[mark jackson]

Thanks a lot. ...... I'll check all playfield contacts, pop bumper contacts, and the eject hole contacts. ............ I'll be back to let u know how it went. ....... Cheers, Mark

[mark jackson]

............ I checked all playfield switches, kicking rubbers, rollovers, bumpers etc. All contacts seem to be adjusted correctly. ............ Same result.  ...... This has got me really stumped. Any other ideas are welcomed. Thanks, Mark

[Freiherr]

Is there a stepper unit that is not reseting properly. These can get dirty and can cause motor to run continually.

It's a wild shot, but you checked everything else.

[mark jackson]

I don't believe there is a stepper unit apart from the 0-9 unit which never re-sets.  ..... I'm obviously missing something here that should be 'leaping out at me'. .... It's at times like this that I'm reminded just how limited my true understanding of these machines really is. As I say ... if it's not in the Hank De Jaeger pinball repair book then I'm usually stumped. Any other hints will be tried.

[arcadoz]

If you are talking about the relay bank that has a number of relays that are reset with a bar, check for a contact that is operated by the bar. From memory, it's not that easy to see.

[millsy]

Have you checked the Score Motor (Broken,loose wire or contact) ?
Follow the Start up sequence http://pinballaustralia.com/startupG.htm
Check all relays etc in the sequence for Broken,loose wire or contact etc.

[mark jackson]

Another day, same ol' same ol'. I've just been over the machine again, checking all the contacts and wiring on the score-motor, start, and re-set relays. Checked the score-reels again, although these are seemingly working fine. I did find one small thing. The replay button would not activate the machine, but the coin chute contacts did. In the book it says that this is caused by an 'open' tilt switch in the front door or in the machine somewhere. All the tilt contacts and wiring seems to be ok, so I have no idea why this would be doing this either.
Does anyone know a good pinnie mechanic on the NSW Central Coast? Don't think I'll have much success with this by myself. Thanks for all the suggestions, much appreciated.

[Retropin]

Hi mate..

Have you checked that all 5 balls are registered as closed in the trough?.. If one of these is open or intermittent, it causes all sorts of logic issues. Sometimes with this fault it comes and goes as you lift the PF as the balls move off the switches, so often a forced closure is required

[oldpins]

Your replay button will not start a new game unless you have a credit/s on the machine(unless set up for free play), however the coin chute switch is seen as a credit which will start a new game.

Just a suggestion on the reset - remove, clean and reseat all Jones plugs going to the back box and playfield.

[mark jackson]

Hi guys, Good to hear from u. I haven't had a chance today to try further.  .... both suggestions are well worth checking on. The other thing I thought of was maybe a switch in the replay unit in the head. .... The only reason I say this was I remember years ago when my Queen Of Diamonds sounded just loud and awful on start-up. It turned out to be one of those small white plastic spacers which keep a set of contacts apart. When this fell off and the contact was on all the time .... well that was why that machine wouldn't do reset/start game properly. What do you think??