Author Topic: Triple Thick 500 disaster  (Read 1015 times)

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Offline illawarra_steelers

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Triple Thick 500 disaster
« on: September 20, 2009, 07:05:57 PM »
Thought this might be of interest....(hope you have a bit of time to kill)

http://groups.google.com/group/rec.games.pinball/browse_thread/thread/d434c82734658b0f#


Offline Extra Ball

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Re: Triple Thick 500 disaster
« Reply #1 on: September 20, 2009, 07:20:07 PM »
I have only used it once (on Nugent), and applied 5 coats. I misted it on though (no way was it going to blow flakes off). Scarey stuff to hear about.

Offline Retropin

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Re: Triple Thick 500 disaster
« Reply #2 on: September 20, 2009, 07:42:07 PM »
Have heard of this before - good friend in USA had his APOLLO BG just completely drop out after TT had been on for 5 years - pulled in at the edges slightly and then one day just all fell off... another had a similar thing happen.
Ive never used it and never will.. ive also never sealed a BG unless it was necessary, can honestly say that i dont believe in sealing to protect a perfectly good BG - if she starts to go then of course address the issue, the coating should also be as thin as possible - the thicker it is, the more risk you take.... well, thats always been my theory and i aint budging from it.

Offline swamprat96

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Re: Triple Thick 500 disaster
« Reply #3 on: September 20, 2009, 07:46:58 PM »
I only use it for BG's that are going to fall apart without it. However Clay Harrel swears by it buit does say its up to your spraypainting skill. I have not had a problem in 15 years with this but as the yanks say your mileage may vary.


Offline SPURR

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Re: Triple Thick 500 disaster
« Reply #4 on: September 20, 2009, 08:23:50 PM »
Thanks Tony for bringing this up. I have never used it and after reading this well I dont know. I have used mylar with great results although.

Offline pinnies4me

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Re: Triple Thick 500 disaster
« Reply #5 on: September 20, 2009, 10:04:14 PM »
I had been reading that thread the last couple of days, and it did get me worried. When I first got my Asteroid Annie, it was in the horrible old damp garage I had at the last house, and when I brought it in to start work, noticed that the ink had started slightly peeling in one area, so quickly gave it the triple thick treatment. Hadn't thought about it again until that RGP thread, pretty scary - the glass cost me more than the game! Not sure I'll do any more unless desperate.
“If you wanna escape, go up to a pinball machine. There’s a magic button on the front that takes you to a world under the glass and makes the the rest of the universe disappear.”

Offline Retropin

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Re: Triple Thick 500 disaster
« Reply #6 on: September 20, 2009, 10:11:37 PM »
It has to be said though that thousands of BG's have been TT'd presumably successfully.
Bottom line is that no matter what BG you have, its a gamble just how long the artwork will remain on there - variables like humidity, temp change, scratches etc all speed up its demise. If a BG is flaking or lifting, its on its way out and TT will prolong its life quite a bit.
Are some BG's better than others? Well...yes, even off the same model game - one BG will outlast another - depends on how clean glass was at manufacture, composition of inks etc - A print off one day may last 10 years longer than a print off the next day - its just the way it works.
 The European prints tend to be much better quality than US ones - a Segasa BG will have survived over the years looking far better than a Williams, Gottlieb reds are a problem etc etc etc.
I dont use TT, i dont touch a BG with anything unless i REALLY have to.
Yes the guys BG is ruined, but was it really necessary to TT?

If a BG is going to flake - its going to flake... what i do is watch the amount of flaking - normally starts at the bottom. Mark on the BG just where the flaking ends with a dot from a marker - if it goes beyond this, its dying a slow death and needs to be sealed. Chances are though that it may never go beyond the mark.. it may not flake any further... its all down to how well its adhered to the glass in the first place.
if you are going to seal then do it in light coats - allow to COMPLETELY set before the next coat - dont go doing it in thick amounts straight off.

The idea is to have the paint stuck to the glass, if the TT or whatever is used is thick and sets then any slight shrinkage will just pull off the artwork - after all something has to give, with light coats, shrinkage is at a bare minimum... and NEVER try to speed up the drying process, slowly but surely is the go

Offline Strangeways

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Re: Triple Thick 500 disaster
« Reply #7 on: September 20, 2009, 10:38:07 PM »


I've never had issues with TT. As long as the glass is prepared correctly and you don't spray in hot or cold conditions, I don't see a problem. I NEVER Seal a backglass "for the hell of it" - I ONLY seal them when they are deteriorating to a point where it will get worse over time.
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Offline illawarra_steelers

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Re: Triple Thick 500 disaster
« Reply #8 on: September 20, 2009, 10:45:30 PM »
I have been following it with much interest.

In all the years of collecting have never touched the rear of a backglass for this very reason

Not concerned about today...concerned about tomorrow and what might happen

The same applies for the clear coat on playfileds

Offline Extra Ball

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Re: Triple Thick 500 disaster
« Reply #9 on: September 20, 2009, 10:51:13 PM »
Clear coating PFs, how long have guys been doing this? I can see big problems when the CC starts to wear.

Offline Retropin

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Re: Triple Thick 500 disaster
« Reply #10 on: September 20, 2009, 11:54:06 PM »
Clear coating PFs, how long have guys been doing this? I can see big problems when the CC starts to wear.


Absolutely!!!  Depending on the CC though - it can be removed

Offline wonder

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Re: Triple Thick 500 disaster
« Reply #11 on: September 21, 2009, 09:56:45 AM »


I've never had issues with TT. As long as the glass is prepared correctly and you don't spray in hot or cold conditions, I don't see a problem. I NEVER Seal a back glass "for the hell of it" - I ONLY seal them when they are deteriorating to a point where it will get worse over time.

Not sure what to do now as just checked my kiss back glass and has just started to bubble in the middle of the kiss wording.Was a 10/10 now down to 8/10 not happy. ^.^
Have used TT before with no problems but not on a bally repro before.Should i go a head and do it as the bubbling only going to get worse or is there a better product to use.

Even a bigger problem is that i have a few other nos black glass and don't wont it to happen to them as well as all nos.Was going to TT them as well but don't no what to do or use now. ^&^

If i don't do something with them now ,they will start to bubble,and i will be not happy. !!!
What other products can i use and i don't wont to spray them and then check 3 month later and find out that i stuffed them all.
« Last Edit: September 21, 2009, 10:12:46 AM by wonder »
pharaoh blackglass <br />blackknight project<br />NOS Playfields

Offline Extra Ball

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Re: Triple Thick 500 disaster
« Reply #12 on: September 21, 2009, 10:19:17 AM »
Skybeau (Ken) rates Markseal. 

Offline Rod71

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Re: Triple Thick 500 disaster
« Reply #13 on: September 21, 2009, 10:50:54 AM »


Not sure what to do now as just checked my kiss back glass and has just started to bubble in the middle of the kiss wording.Was a 10/10 now down to 8/10 not happy. ^.^



Weird. Is it in a game?. Do you have it stored somewhere?. Just curious to know if it's in your house, garage, shed etc.


Offline Strangeways

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Re: Triple Thick 500 disaster
« Reply #14 on: September 21, 2009, 10:59:40 AM »


I've never had issues with TT. As long as the glass is prepared correctly and you don't spray in hot or cold conditions, I don't see a problem. I NEVER Seal a back glass "for the hell of it" - I ONLY seal them when they are deteriorating to a point where it will get worse over time.

Not sure what to do now as just checked my kiss back glass and has just started to bubble in the middle of the kiss wording.Was a 10/10 now down to 8/10 not happy. ^.^
Have used TT before with no problems but not on a bally repro before.Should i go a head and do it as the bubbling only going to get worse or is there a better product to use.

Even a bigger problem is that i have a few other nos black glass and don't wont it to happen to them as well as all nos.Was going to TT them as well but don't no what to do or use now. ^&^

If i don't do something with them now ,they will start to bubble,and i will be not happy. !!!
What other products can i use and i don't wont to spray them and then check 3 month later and find out that i stuffed them all.


If I were you Craig ;

Leave NOS backglasses alone !

I would consider sealing the KISS glass if it looks like flaking.

Lets remember WHY this is happening.. The main reason is that when these machines were operated, they were left on all day, nearly everyday. So the heat from the #44 lamps basically "toasted" the backglass over 20 - 30 years.

Now this was not too bad on EMs, but lethal on some SS. There are other factors such as different printing process and the thickness of the paint - but all glasses were installed in perfect condition.

I ALWAYS use #47 globes in the backbox of any machine. IF you starte to see wear and tear - remove half of the globes - this is what was done "in the old days" to save the glass from deterioration AND to release the strain on the power supply.

There are other products out there. Steve Young used to have a product called "save my glass" (I think it was called that) - and it was the best product to use.

Clay (Marvin's Site) has used TT for years without an issue - I think his suggestion would be to "perfect the process".


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