Wizard Of OZ Pinball

[Pop Bumper Pete]

Jason, I do not want to pull out or to get a refund

I have faith that the game will be made
I would simply like to know if the machine is coming this year or sometime in 2013
and I would much rather be told by somebody from JJP, rather than be told by somebody third hand

[Pop Bumper Pete]

Pete have you dropped Jack an email ?
He responds to all his emails almost straight away , or if you want give him a ring first thing Tuesday morning and talk to the man himself .

Posted the question two days ago on the forum

[Strangeways]

Pete have you dropped Jack an email ?
He responds to all his emails almost straight away , or if you want give him a ring first thing Tuesday morning and talk to the man himself .

This is the best advise. Hear it straight from the man himself. I think threes not long to wait now Pete - Hold on a bit longer !

[Ant68]

Pete have you dropped Jack an email ?
He responds to all his emails almost straight away , or if you want give him a ring first thing Tuesday morning and talk to the man himself .

Posted the question two days ago on the forum

Jack gets bombarded on his forum , do me a favour and give him a ring or drop him an email .

[Caveoftreasures]

a few points.

Jack cant tell people when the machines will be shipped for a few very easy reasons, he doesnt know.
He has a rough idea, but that idea is based upon feedback his team are giving him, and like any deadline where u want your product to stay absolute quality, you dont give dates to people just to keep them happy, you tell them that it will be ready when it will be ready, and apologise for the delay, which I am sure he has done etc.

This is where JJP should be admired. He hasnt rushed the project, he hasnt caved into pressure, he hasnt allowed his WOZ baby to be born less than perfect, and he wont let it out of the door until it is right, and I respect him for that. I call the WOZ pinball a baby, cause like a real baby, and a pregnant woman, the baby comes when the baby is ready, its as simple as that. People are frustrated because it has gone overtime, I was also frustrated, but like any great thing in life, you take 3 deep breaths and wait patiently, because absolute quality and the best craftmanship in any industry takes time. Every extra day u wait, is a extra day they are moulding this pinball machine closer to being one of, if not, the most advanced pinball machine ever made in the history of the game.

Its a waste of time emailing anyone, cause it will come when it comes. Pretend it will be another 6 months, and when it arrives in a few months, think you got it early. JJP are doing the best they can. Jack himself, I feel sorry for, because he has probably been harrassed from sun-up to sun-down, and this time he spends answering emails from impatient people, would be better spent managing the machine etc.
I know most people are frustrated, but shit happens. JJP has taken responsibility for that I am sure, but as consumers, we must be realistic, you either wait for delivery, or cash in and buy another product.

Even if u email Jack and get an answer, it can only say one of a few possibilities -
1. Its ready when its ready
2. We should be shipping late 2012 and early to mid 2013 at the latest.
What else can the man say in an answer ?.

It will be here soon, and it will be worth the wait, then u get to enjoy it forever.

[swinks]

a few points.

Jack cant tell people when the machines will be shipped for a few very easy reasons, he doesnt know.
He has a rough idea, but that idea is based upon feedback his team are giving him, and like any deadline where u want your product to stay absolute quality, you dont give dates to people just to keep them happy, you tell them that it will be ready when it will be ready, and apologise for the delay, which I am sure he has done etc.

This is where JJP should be admired. He hasnt rushed the project, he hasnt caved into pressure, he hasnt allowed his WOZ baby to be born less than perfect, and he wont let it out of the door until it is right, and I respect him for that. I call the WOZ pinball a baby, cause like a real baby, and a pregnant woman, the baby comes when the baby is ready, its as simple as that. People are frustrated because it has gone overtime, I was also frustrated, but like any great thing in life, you take 3 deep breaths and wait patiently, because absolute quality and the best craftmanship in any industry takes time. Every extra day u wait, is a extra day they are moulding this pinball machine closer to being one of, if not, the most advanced pinball machine ever made in the history of the game.

Its a waste of time emailing anyone, cause it will come when it comes. Pretend it will be another 6 months, and when it arrives in a few months, think you got it early. JJP are doing the best they can. Jack himself, I feel sorry for, because he has probably been harrassed from sun-up to sun-down, and this time he spends answering emails from impatient people, would be better spent managing the machine etc.
I know most people are frustrated, but shit happens. JJP has taken responsibility for that I am sure, but as consumers, we must be realistic, you either wait for delivery, or cash in and buy another product.

Even if u email Jack and get an answer, it can only say one of a few possibilities -
1. Its ready when its ready
2. We should be shipping late 2012 and early to mid 2013 at the latest.
What else can the man say in an answer ?.

It will be here soon, and it will be worth the wait, then u get to enjoy it forever.

+1  -  some wise words Cavey, well said

on the flip side I understand Pete's frustration along with others waiting, but the danger in getting a date could mean some other issues could delay the date a bit more next year. Hopefully once the first machine is out JJP learns alot and future production is more fine tuned and better timed.

Email him personally and expect the worst of the possible dates he gives to you and if you get it earlier than the worst case it's a bonus.

[Retropin]

Last 2 posts were excellent!

You have to read between the lines with all Jacks stuff.. same as anything else.
He is being blasted for missing the deadline.. if i were him id be VERY reluctant to give another unless it is absolute concrete.

Jack has had all new tooling done and now has signature parts... my guess is that he didnt really intend to do this and it has been born out of necessity which would give significant delays.
It would have been far easier to buy a large batch of WILLIAMS or STERN coils etc and make a pinball using them... maybe these people either wouldnt or couldnt fulfill Jacks request?
In saying this though... its all done now and everything can be done " in house".
My old man always told me that if i have to rely on others then expect to be let down time and time again.
Delays like this would be for the first game only... i expect Jacks silverball to be running at a cracking pace after this

[Pop Bumper Pete]

I know most people are frustrated, but shit happens. JJP has taken responsibility for that I am sure, but as consumers, we must be realistic, you either wait for delivery, or cash in and buy another product.

Even if u email Jack and get an answer, it can only say one of a few possibilities -
1. Its ready when its ready
2. We should be shipping late 2012 and early to mid 2013 at the latest.
What else can the man say in an answer ?.

It will be here soon, and it will be worth the wait, then u get to enjoy it forever.

yes, if it does not ship for another 6 months, I will not be happy, but I can still live with that

I find it annoying that they seem to have the attitude 'Keep the customer in the dark'

I have sent an e-mail, now I will have to wait 2 days for a reply

[Caveoftreasures]

These comments are NOT directed at anyone here on AP, but a generalisation about every waiting/enthusiastic person so to speak in the pinball industry.lol  

I think the pinball community is one of the hardest customer communitys in the world to keep happy. Firstly, when it comes to pinball machines, everyone has their version or opinion as to what is or isnt the worlds most perfect pinball machine. People nit-pik the smallest of features, then want or dont want everything and anything in a pinball machine, and then have very specific ideas about marketing, or non marketing, delivery times, how a machine is produced or not produced, who designs it or doesnt design it, gee we are a hard batch of people to keep happy i can tell you.  

I wonder sometimes if the pinball companies think the pinball community are nutters, or just full of passion, and/or are hard task masters, or just a batch of whinging bastards who can never be made to be kept happy. I am sure pinball enthususiasts are certainly not deemed to be timid, quiet or laidback with their customer feedback or ideas. Just thinking about the correspondence these poor bastards at Stern or JJP get makes me want to take 5 valium.lol  

I think sometimes its both comical, sad and human nature that grown men, probably in their dozens, if not hundreds, have written to JJP and have demanded, if not at least have pushed extremely very hard to know when exactly the machine is coming.  I see a picture in my head of people all sitting around a huge kitchen table, with knife n fork in hand, aiming up in the air like guns ready for action, like they are waiting hungry for their dinner to arive from the JJP kitchen, but the thing to remember, is that JJP are serving up a pinball machine, made of wood and wires, not a food product, but everyone wants the machine yesterday, like its their last meal, like they are starving, and its the only meal, which means life or death if u dont get that WOZ sustanence on time. lol  Everyone forgets, incl me sometimes, its only a pinball machine, a luxury item, something that isnt going to make or break a life, if its here today or not. But when we want our new pinball machines, we want them NOW. Its our new big toy. Men like their toys.


We are a tough crowd to please. If only I could draw a picture and add it to the computer, you would see the cartoon in my head, of people desperate for the WOZ feed. Jack's dressed as a waiter, with his finger pointed to his watch, with the production staff all dressed as chefs and kitchen staff all running around the huge pinball kitchen putting out fires.lol    Then, the meal arrives, phewww, its all over, or is it.
Now its time to tell the chef if the meal is or isnt up to scratch. Jack serving the main meal, and shipping out the product isnt the end, its just the start for the poor bastard, he hasnt been critiqued yet on the meal, his nightmare has only just begun.lol  

Something tells me he will be ringing Gary Stern, and asking how the hell have you been doing this for all these years and you havent gone completely crazy. Gary replies, you should see the medication I take daily just to go into the factory, just to be able to deal with the nutty pinball community.  

Jack, get ready for alot of grey hair mate. Its coming, if it hasnt already started to overtake and dominate your hair colour.  

[Pop Bumper Pete]

CoT, imagine if I came to you and asked for a new security system, and you told me that the new and improved ‘Fry and Die’ was coming soon, just pay up front and wait

One dead line passes, then another, then another
Would you contact your customers, advise them of the delay?
Maybe keep them informed of the current level of progress?

[RottyGuy]

Maybe keep them informed of the current level of progress?

That's the least they should be doing. Very poor if that's the case. Take the customers money and leave them guessing.

[Sunfox]

In my opinion - and I am a pre-orderer from the very first day - this is one of the downsides to having so many people paid up in full. It entirely removes the dire necessity of having a product out at a certain time, or face certain financial ruin.

You see, Jack wants to create a perfect product... the ultimate pinball... and his team is attempting to do so, no matter what major issues are thrown in their path - and there have been plenty.

However, it's because they're financially secure that they can afford to take their time and let the months slip by. I'm not saying I would rather have a rushed product - I do want this done right. But as a perfectionist myself, I know that perfection is an unobtainable goal that you can spend an inordinate amount of time striving to reach. But on the other hand, people up against a hard time and money crunch can be rather innovative in finding solutions while still managing to maintain quality.

[coon82]

Last 2 posts were excellent!

You have to read between the lines with all Jacks stuff.. same as anything else.
He is being blasted for missing the deadline.. if i were him id be VERY reluctant to give another unless it is absolute concrete.

Jack has had all new tooling done and now has signature parts... my guess is that he didnt really intend to do this and it has been born out of necessity which would give significant delays.
It would have been far easier to buy a large batch of WILLIAMS or STERN coils etc and make a pinball using them... maybe these people either wouldnt or couldnt fulfill Jacks request?
In saying this though... its all done now and everything can be done " in house".
My old man always told me that if i have to rely on others then expect to be let down time and time again.
Delays like this would be for the first game only... i expect Jacks silverball to be running at a cracking pace after this

Totally agree IMHO 

[swinks]

another reason to stay in

&feature=channel&list=UL

one awesome platform

[Caveoftreasures]

CoT, imagine if I came to you and asked for a new security system, and you told me that the new and improved ‘Fry and Die’ was coming soon, just pay up front and wait

One dead line passes, then another, then another
Would you contact your customers, advise them of the delay?
Maybe keep them informed of the current level of progress?

YES, definately, all cstomers shld be kept up to date at all times. I dont go to market in my industry til we have a tried n true tested product in hand.
Things are different here in Pinball land, but customer focus and education at all stages sets u apart from any and everyone. Being professional in a professional Industry requires it !
Because I pulled out, and because I didnt bother keeping in the loop with any of the WOZ forum stuff, or any of the JJP announcements, I have only kept up to date with the progress by visiting this thread.

I had assumed you guys (current WOZ paid customers) were geting REGULAR updates from JJP as to what was happening etc etc.
Even if it was a email once every 8 weeks that said we are progressing well, but running behind it would be enough for me.
What have the JJP customers been getting, and how often ? Havent u guys been getting regular JJP updates ?  

P.S - the green start button on the WOZ machine is fine for home use only market, although it looks cheap.
It SHOULD be recessed into the cabinet, and not surface mounted, because kids (*destructive little bastards) will smash that off in 5 minutes in  commercial environments, or even pissed adults who lose their ball/game too quick can kick it off. It should be recessed for vandalism purposes. Pinball 101 I would have thought ?   Anyone else notice that ??