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Author Topic: Sad undercurrent  (Read 7005 times)

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Offline Pop Bumper Pete

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Sad undercurrent
« on: November 29, 2009, 08:28:30 AM »
I know that a lot of Aussie Pinball members have issues with a certain ‘Bally/ Williams license holder’, fine, I am not here to change your mind.
But in my short time here I have seen two threads where people have been trying to ‘highlight’ the issues they have with him.

I thought Aussie Pinball was supposed to be above that sort of stuff

Personally I would much prefer to have a positive vibe running through this forum rather than the undercurrent of ‘F*** W****’ that seems to be lurking around.

There is a lot of great stuff on this forum, please try to keep Aussie pinball a positive place to visit

Pete
« Last Edit: November 29, 2009, 08:30:30 AM by Pinky »
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Offline Creech

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Re: Sad undercurrent
« Reply #1 on: November 29, 2009, 08:48:49 AM »
Couldn't agree more Pete. Unfortunately pinball is one of those hobbies that evokes strong emotions in people, for various reasons. What are we to do? Censor every post that comes in that has anything to do with the issue you are talking about. Then we would be seen as "just another forum that has its own agenda to maintain". Freedom of speech is a good thing!

I assure you, that sort of talk will not drag this place down or destroy it. That's why we started up in the first place. To escape that kind of rubbish. If it gets out of hand, threads will be closed. Enjoy the place for being 99.9% helpful towards the hobbyist. Unfortunately you will get 0.01% of posts that are political or controversial. It's not all peaches and cream out there I'm afraid.

All I can say to you is that we will always be monitoring AP for that kind of content and will act appropriately if/when it happens.
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Offline Pop Bumper Pete

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Re: Sad undercurrent
« Reply #2 on: November 29, 2009, 09:13:27 AM »
Thank you for your reply

I have always respected the reasons why you started up this site (even though I do not mind the 'argy-bargy' that gets posted elsewhere ;)  )
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Offline Extra Ball

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Re: Sad undercurrent
« Reply #3 on: November 29, 2009, 09:17:56 AM »
I dont see the undercurrent you describe. I see a thread where Brett is making his bold stand, and thats it really. I did see a totally different set rapids, had my winge, and moved-on. This forum runs along quite well, I dont think the mods/admins have much to worry about.
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Offline Caveoftreasures

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Re: Sad undercurrent
« Reply #4 on: November 29, 2009, 09:25:20 AM »
 YEH, MY BAD.    YEH, MY BAD    YEH, MY BAD     YEH, MY BAD    YEH, MY BAD   YEH, MY BAD    YEH, MY BAD    YEH, MY BAD   YEH,MY BAD

YEH, MY BAD.    YEH, MY BAD    YEH, MY BAD     YEH, MY BAD    YEH, MY BAD   YEH, MY BAD    YEH, MY BAD    YEH, MY BAD   YEH,MY BAD

YEH, MY BAD.    YEH, MY BAD    YEH, MY BAD     YEH, MY BAD    YEH, MY BAD   YEH, MY BAD    YEH, MY BAD    YEH, MY BAD   YEH,MY BAD

Sorry Pinky, the passion that nice man evokes, just escapes me sometimes. I did say along the way, that if i upset anyone, i apologise in advance.
I will behave more in the future. Also, like our buddy from down south, I have a licence for WMS as well, got mine out of the corn flakes box this morning, theres a few going around.  *)*  *)*  *)*

p.s- are u looking for any cheaper decals   %$%  %$%  %$%

 *)*  *)*  *)*  *)*  *)*  *)*  *)*  *)*  *)*  *)*  *)*  *)*  *)*  *)*  *)*  *)*  *)*  *)*  *)*  *)*  *)*  *)*  *)*  *)*  *)*  *)*   *)*  *)*  *)*
« Last Edit: November 29, 2009, 09:29:23 AM by caveoftreasures »
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Offline ajlaird

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Re: Sad undercurrent
« Reply #5 on: November 29, 2009, 09:29:13 AM »
The signal to noise ratio (good stuff compared to the negative stuff) on this site is very high. Very occasionally someone will raise a more negative thread but on the whole it just doesn't happen that much. With such a broad membership this is bound to happen every now and then. I think you have been 'unlucky' in terms of timing to see two such threads (negative in your opinion) in a short time.

Personally I usually just ignore it if I think it is negative. I have had no dealings with said person so I have no opinion either way.
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Offline Pop Bumper Pete

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Re: Sad undercurrent
« Reply #6 on: November 29, 2009, 09:59:52 AM »
Quote from: caveoftreasures on November 29, 2009, 09:25:20 AM
YEH, MY BAD.    YEH, MY BAD    YEH, MY BAD     YEH, MY BAD    YEH, MY BAD   YEH, MY BAD    YEH, MY BAD    YEH, MY BAD   YEH,MY BAD

YEH, MY BAD.    YEH, MY BAD    YEH, MY BAD     YEH, MY BAD    YEH, MY BAD   YEH, MY BAD    YEH, MY BAD    YEH, MY BAD   YEH,MY BAD

YEH, MY BAD.    YEH, MY BAD    YEH, MY BAD     YEH, MY BAD    YEH, MY BAD   YEH, MY BAD    YEH, MY BAD    YEH, MY BAD   YEH,MY BAD

Sorry Pinky, the passion that nice man evokes, just escapes me sometimes. I did say along the way, that if i upset anyone, i apologise in advance.
I will behave more in the future. Also, like our buddy from down south, I have a licence for WMS as well, got mine out of the corn flakes box this morning, theres a few going around.  *)*  *)*  *)*

p.s- are u looking for any cheaper decals   %$%  %$%  %$%

 *)*  *)*  *)*  *)*  *)*  *)*  *)*  *)*  *)*  *)*  *)*  *)*  *)*  *)*  *)*  *)*  *)*  *)*  *)*  *)*  *)*  *)*  *)*  *)*  *)*  *)*   *)*  *)*  *)*

My point is why not just post that you are making cabinet side art with top quality ink?
Tell us that they will not fade or rub off and they use non-smelly glue

I want to hear how great YOUR product is.

I have bought from other retailers, I know their quality (or lack thereof)
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Offline Homepin

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Re: Sad undercurrent
« Reply #7 on: November 29, 2009, 10:23:26 AM »
Quote from: Pinky on November 29, 2009, 09:59:52 AM
Quote from: caveoftreasures on November 29, 2009, 09:25:20 AM



My point is why not just post that you are making cabinet side art with top quality ink?
Tell us that they will not fade or rub off and they use non-smelly glue

I want to hear how great YOUR product is.

I have bought from other retailers, I know their quality (or lack thereof)


Very simple - the second you mention anything like this you WILL receive a stream of threatening and abusive emails that suggest you will  be strung up if you dare proceed. I have been on the receving end from this "chap" both privatly and publically and he does not seem to be a rational, logical businessman IMO. He can, naturally, choose to conduct his business in any manner that he likes within the law and I think that he probably does do that.

Again - IMO - he is the one major 'thing' that is holding back the development of pinball in Australia and probably worldwide! Why people still do any business with him is truly beyond my understanding.........
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Offline Retropin

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Re: Sad undercurrent
« Reply #8 on: November 29, 2009, 10:38:27 AM »
And the sad thing is that MANY of us have been on the receiving end of the threats - myself included. The reason for mine was so petty it was astounding!

If there is an under current of bad feeling then it was through no fault of any other person than the one in question... its ALMOST a case of you reap what you sow... unfortunately what is being reaped is nowhere near as vicious as what is sown.
Person in question is a sad man and an outright liar who is ripping you off with the lies... there is no defence for his actions.
In all honesty... the negative thread you mention is actually quite positive.... my desire is to see pinball flourish as is anyone elses on this forum.
This will NEVER happen with this man in the industry.. I will NEVER do business with this vile person


( and trust me - this post is positive!)
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Offline pinnies4me

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Re: Sad undercurrent
« Reply #9 on: November 29, 2009, 10:53:24 AM »
Unfortunately Pete the views expressed in that thread seem to have wide support, so it is not really possible to stop it surfacing from time to time. RGP for example (the ultimate in non-moderation) is cluttered with hundreds of threads on that sort of topic. It is a credit to AP that while that issue surfaced there was lots of good humour about some of the comments rather than over the top rudeness that can be found elsewhere.

On the other hand I have seen the results of constant thread tampering and it's not ideal either. Creech has covered the issue well.

I respect your opinion Pete, and hope members think about the positives with our great hobby, and whether what they have to say (if it is negative) needs to be said before posting. That seems to work here almost all of the time. Like any relationship though (as we as members are) there will be disagreement and controversy from time to time.
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Offline Pop Bumper Pete

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Re: Sad undercurrent
« Reply #10 on: November 29, 2009, 11:06:58 AM »
Sorry, but I always felt that Creech set up his alternative pinball forums because he wanted to talk pinball, not the politics of pinball

I find it odd that people claim to want a constructive site, (and it is ) until W’s name comes up, then all bets are off, the gloves come out, and the negative BS starts to fly
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Offline Creech

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Re: Sad undercurrent
« Reply #11 on: November 29, 2009, 11:17:29 AM »
Pinky, that's exactly the reason this site was setup. What would you like me to do, make a rule that nobody can mention certain people? If someone starts a thread mentioning certain people, would you like me to delete the thread immediately? I don't believe in that. I believe in letting people have their say, provided there are no slanderous overtones and the truth is spoken. I have seen first hand what censorship, favouritism and protectionism does to a forum. This site promotes positive discussion, not negative. I can assure you as soon as things get out of hand we will act. I see no reason to act at this stage. People are just describing their real life situations with the person in question. Why shouldn't we all know about that if it helps us make a better decision in the future?

Your initial post by it's very nature was political. I could have deleted it if I so wished. Your post in fact contributed to the sad undercurrent you spoke about. As you can see, I had no control over that. You decided to post it, not me. I can't control that. I have as much right to censor your post as I do others but I'm not about to do that. Why not? Because you are only speaking from your heart, not out of your arse. You have a right to ask the question and it has been answered very well by a few members here.

Tell me Pinky, are you in any way affiliated with the said person? It sounds like you are a lone voice in an avalanche of nay sayers...
« Last Edit: November 29, 2009, 11:21:59 AM by Creech »
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Offline Homepin

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Re: Sad undercurrent
« Reply #12 on: November 29, 2009, 11:18:47 AM »
Quote from: Pinky on November 29, 2009, 11:06:58 AM
Sorry, but I always felt that Creech set up his alternative pinball forums because he wanted to talk pinball, not the politics of pinball

I find it odd that people claim to want a constructive site, (and it is ) until W’s name comes up, then all bets are off, the gloves come out, and the negative BS starts to fly


It is sad but the statement "and the negative BS starts to fly" is incorrect - anything negative said about this 'gent' is rarely going to be "BS"!
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Offline Extra Ball

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Re: Sad undercurrent
« Reply #13 on: November 29, 2009, 11:19:41 AM »
Pinky if you find a thread distasteful then dont read it. Mods/admins censoring members' experiences and opinions will actually work against the common good of the community. Both australian forums serve people in similar, and different ways. Dispite the "troubles" of "the before time" both forums have come out stronger and better at what they do.
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Offline Strangeways

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Re: Sad undercurrent
« Reply #14 on: November 29, 2009, 11:25:56 AM »
Tony (Creech) is 100% right, and we have tried VERY hard to keep this place positive. I think in our first year, we closed ONE thread because it was getting out of hand. IMO that's an average I can live with, and it meets the objective we had in mind when starting the forum. We (mods) don't edit posts according to an agenda - it is best to "let it flow" and as Nick mentioned - with a little bit of humor.

Two threads highlighting issues with the said company is also a bit of a miracle, bit unavoidable. I guess members affected by negative experiences wish to share this with the members, as we do with the positive experiences. Having said that - there are not too many to complain about, but the company we are talking about does not do itself any favors.

As Pete says - lets keep the place positive.

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