Stern Thincoat - Dimples & Craters

[Retropin]

Only Stern would know why they dimple and I doubt they will tell... if it doesn't deviate the ball then its not really an issue. No worse than rolling over a Mylar edge

[GORGAR 1]

Posts look fine Rob no issues there and also zero ball deviation so really it's just personal choice it's never bothered me if I see a few dimples :) also new sterns are so dam fast there will always be air balls and to me that's part of rush :)

[pinball god]

Posts look fine Rob no issues there and also zero ball deviation so really it's just personal choice it's never bothered me if I see a few dimples :) also new sterns are so dam fast there will always be air balls and to me that's part of rush :)

that might be the answer. Air balls pounding the pf. Maybe older b/w games etc might not have many air balls equalling less damage

[GORGAR 1]

Posts look fine Rob no issues there and also zero ball deviation so really it's just personal choice it's never bothered me if I see a few dimples :) also new sterns are so dam fast there will always be air balls and to me that's part of rush :)

that might be the answer. Air balls pounding the pf. Maybe older b/w games etc might not have many air balls equalling less damage

Yeah you might be right :) these games are lightning fast :)

[Freiherr]

The other thing that AC/DC worried me at first was how the playfield would cope with the cannon shots. I expected more wear on lower left playfield. In actual fact, no problems here so far.

[pinball god]

My fh repro pf, 1697 games no dimples or marks near ball drop. Did get an extra cc before install

[Strangeways]

I've taken photos of the dimple damage, but the glare obscured them. I took several videos that the problem is highlighted. I'll see how I go with uploading it. It is quite large.

I recently examined a "restored" ST TNG playfield installed in a game. It was clearly too thick, and it had divots / dimples all over it. I assume the same wood is used on all ST TNG games - original playfield - just badly cleared. The divot / dimples were caused by the ball impacting to poor clearcoat.

[Strangeways]

OK - I've screen capped the videos - they are simply too large to upload etc.

Now this post and these pictures need to be taken in context. Please don't be a fool and view these as a "Stern bashing thread".

This is an issue that I took an interest in as Greg used to buy a second playfield for each of his NIB game BECAUSE of this exact issue. I was alarmed at the need to buy another playfield, but that's what he did. The SOLE purpose was to have them sent off to HRP for a proper clearcoat. Now I'm a KISS LE buyer, and if this is what is acceptable or "normal" for NIB buyers, then I'll buy another playfield and have it professionally cleared - I have NO PROBLEM doing that. I have not seen this issue in detail on other games. It is not prevalent on CSI, the other Stern i really like playing.

These are photos of Greg's TWD LE - Circa 100 games. I did not want to move the game outside in the sun - which would have showed every minute detail - I left the game inside the showroom and guided the phone camera under the reflection of the fluro which is overhead. The "craters", "dimples", "divots", "ball impressions" - whatever you want to call them - are ALL OVER the playfield EXCEPT the shooter lane and inlanes / outlanes. They are not isolated to the areas with the fluro reflection, they are everywhere.
































It is a problem for a $11,000 pinball machine to have this issue. I personally think that it is simply not acceptable. In a way, I'm looking forward to other's CONSTRUCTIVE comments, as it may lead to me asking for another playfield. If it is "the norm", then I'll write to Stern asking them if they think it is acceptable.

My question is ;

Is this the normal appearance of a $11,000 pinball's playfield after 100 games ?

Is this an isolated case, and I have a genuine claim to ask Stern for a replacement playfield ?

[Freiherr]

Nino, that is seriously bad. My 3 Sterns are nothing like that.
Looking at some of the bigger craters, could it be that they are now applying a thicker  layer and not allowing sufficient curing time before shipping?

[GORGAR 1]

I don't think that's normal after only 100 games, my WD has 100's of games and I struggle to see them. Nino send photos to Stern or the distributor as they'd be very interested with it I'm sure. I just noticed the magnet has them how? That's not cleared.

[Caveoftreasures]

Every playfield is unique because the wood is from different trees Ofcourse so some playfields will have it, some won't.

Some dimples are from the wood and some from the clearcoat. It's going to be impossible to say.

I can only add that I have never seen a playfield on any game, from any manufacturer without pre existing dimpling.
Some have a small amount everywhere, some have a large amount only in some areas, some a combination.
The playfield is wood, the bealls are steel like others have said. What can you do ? Nothing from any factory mass produced games or you just play it and change the playfield in 5 or 10 years of you don't like the factory finish.

It's probably time to seek answers from Sterns engineering/product development dept for those who are worried.
The fact that every playfield is unique because of the wood means you are going to probably going to end up going in circles.

We are back to wood and steel balls.
We are back to people having major different personal tastes and expectations.
It's going to be a personal decision here and some will care and others won't.

Can anyone definitively say what dimpling is or isn't caused by.
Only the people who make the playfields can probably answer this.
I don't think the clear should be described as thincoat. I think it's fairer to say it's standard factory clearcoat. The same as any of the manufacturers have done over the past 30 years. Everyone has their own opinion. As long as u are happy with your own and unique game, that is all that matters..

P.S - the zombies artwork look great on the playfield don't they.

[andypinboy]

Nino my mate's AC/DC is very similar - BUT I would say the dimpling (craters really) under the "L" in WELL are markedly worse than anything on his playfield. So it's a bit of each but personally I think you'd have a decent case that this playfield is not fit for purpose & perhaps Stern will replace it.

[Strangeways]

So we will call them "dimples" - just for the sake of describing the problem.

I can confirm 100% it is not the timber. The dimples are on the inserts. The inserts are not made of wood. The problem is definitely - 100% - The clearcoat. This playfield was like glass when we unboxed it. no blemishes except the area under the bicycle girl ramp.

I have never seen this issue on other playfields. I did a quick scan of over 30 DMDs today, and not one of them has this issue. I have seen enough playfields - I've even seen a Dr Who with the clear worn away to reveal the serial number etched into the playfield. The ONLY place I've seen this ;

1 - This game
2 - A game cleared by a backyarder that was too thick and was populated a week after the clear. Not cured.

The dimpling is caused by the ball - that's clear enough. The ball is impacting on a soft clear. In theory, it should be cured by now - yet it is impossible to say if further play will damage it even further. So until I clear this up (no pun intended), it is an expensive ornament..

[pinnies4me]

The first time I really noticed the Stern thincoat dimpling was on a PotC that had been unboxed just a few day prior. I think it really showed up on that game as the colours are more on the lighter side. At the time i thought it a one off issue. Interestingly my Elvis has little dimpling.

As for recent reproduction playfields I can see a little on the CPR Firepower playfield, but very little on a first run mirco AFM  - and you don't get much faster, plus its renowned for airballs. I think the  ceramic clear coat goes some way to proving that a quality clear coat does add some protection although it may very well be the European ply as well.

[pinball god]

I believe you have a case to request a replacement. I have heard of a big buck pf being replaced but I cannot recall the reasoning. The only thing running against you is the delay in alerting them to the problem. I'd give it a try at the very least