Wizard Of OZ Pinball

[Sunfox]

Pinchroma, you and Sunfox were able to get the pitchfork brigade all worked up about me on another unruly and mostly unmoderated forum because nobody there knows me. Here the members know me for being helpful when they have an electronic problem - I even make one off boards to help them out when I need to. I like to think that my industry and electronic knowledge is well respected here, perhaps I'm wrong, I was once?

The "pitchfork brigade" was worked up by your WORDS, not the people posting screenshots of YOUR WORDS. Take some personal responsibility for calling two countries "idiots with small minds" "living in sheltered worlds"! However, I do notice that you finally removed your insulting text from your webpage. Is there a glimmer of hope that you finally agree that what you said might have been inappropriate? You never did answer my question in the other thread.

[Freiherr]

Could the different boot times be based on cool or warm boots. I have no idea at all how WOZ operates, but having spent over 30 years in IT, I strongly support dedicated hardware to PC vased systems.

The fact that the boot issue has triggered such a barrage of exchanges across the Pacific tells me that the brains of WOZ may be the Achilles heel and maybe the reason for the release delay. People made numerous comments about the high quality of WOZ compared to other pinball which is good if you can get to play it - the wait is pissing people off big time!

I always had a bad gut feel about a pay-up-front model and this thread justifies that feel.

[pinnies4me]

..... the wait is pissing people off big time!

Three years, or the 30 seconds (or three minutes??) it takes to boot??   

Seems the wait will *never* be over for WoZ customers - even after delivery!! 

[Sunfox]

I see Mike's runs on the board with his contribution to the hobby as heavily outweighing the attacks being made by this JPP person;

Mike has delivered in spades as and when with boards and help - never did see anyone wait several years for a reply with a bunch of LIES about delivery dates in between;

The attitude displayed by this JPP employee and the support by his management leaves me quite happy to stick to my classic embedded controller games, safe in the knowledge that what I can't fix can be fixed by experts like Mike.

So, Mike makes boards, so official Aussie Pinball policy is he's allowed to say anything he wants no matter how false it is? This is a serious question I would like an answer to, and do remember I'm not affiliated with JJP.

If he comes in and says Stern pins are made in North Korea using child labor and include small fragmentation bombs in the power supplies that are all synchronized to explode on January 26, 2014... that's now fact and no one is allowed to dare counter his expertise?

[pinnies4me]

So, Mike makes boards, so official Aussie Pinball policy is he's allowed to say anything he wants no matter how false it is? This is a serious question I would like an answer to, and do remember I'm not affiliated with JJP.

If he comes in and says Stern pins are made in North Korea using child labor and include small fragmentation bombs in the power supplies that are all synchronized to explode on January 26, 2014... that's now fact and no one is allowed to dare counter his expertise?

Mike's opinions as well of those from you and Pinchroma have all been left for the world to see. I am not "Aussie Pinball", and have merely expressed my observations and opinion.

That will be the last comment by you attempting to create a *forum* issue.

[Sunfox]

Mike's opinions as well of those from you and Pinchroma have all been left for the world to see. I am not "Aussie Pinball", and have merely expressed my observations and opinion.

That will be the last comment by you attempting to create a *forum* issue.

I will take that as verbal acceptance that uninformed opinions or those based on false information may continue to be countered.

[Homepin]

I will take that as verbal acceptance that uninformed opinions or those based on false information may continue to be countered.

I explained my stand on amusement machines based on PCs in my last long post. They are hardly "uninformed opinions". I have held this belief for many years and it is well founded based on many years of experience directly with this type of equipment. I have been of this opinion for many years before even hearing of Jack or WOZ. I was happy when JJP announced a new veture and then saddened when I found out it was to be PC based.

You are fully entitled to have a differing opinion and I respect that - it seems that you don't accept that anyone could possibly have an opinion that differs to yours.

By the way - did you know Stern pinballs are made by child labour in Nth Korea and have small bo ..............it must be true you told me.......

[Blktgr74]

Well said Gav.

My issue is that Pinchroma  has entered Aussie Pinball in exactly the same way that JJP entered pinball imo, with arrogance and negativity.

How about offering something constructive to the forum and not coming on here for the sole purpose of baiting a valued member of the forum?

I'm not here to chat on this forum.  Merely to stop homepin from continuing to spread LIES.  They aren't opinion.   He states them as if he is in the know.  Check other forums where he got publicly blasted for his complete non-unserstanding of anything he claimed to know about and especially things that are technology related.   People from intel/Microsoft/amd amongst a bunch of other tech savvy people completely disemboweled everything he said so he disappeared (ran home with his tail between his legs) so now he's here spewing the same crap to you guys. 

Sorry but I'm not about to have someone who has zero understanding of a platform or technology preach like his word is gospel and cover it under the veil of "someone told me".

He has refused to actually back up his assertions and you guys back him up for that. Don't you realize how odd that is?   I have fact and video evidence to back up my statements he has conjecture and no proof yet you guys are giving me the 3rd degree?   Sorry as I'm not attacking a country but one of your countrymen is full of crap and hasn't even come back to answer my questions. 

Mike,   Explain your reasonings as for why pc's don't work and how woz is taking 3 minutes to boot and how that's the reason behind delays.   Please answer this.  I am formally calling
You out to back up your "opinions".   Opinions are formed based on an understanding of what you believe to be fact.  Please lay those "facts" out there to be analyzed.   

He WON'T.  GUARANTEED.  Because he's FOS.

I would have thought that if your not here to chat or contribute then you are the one that is FOS and need to crawl back under the rock from where you came.

[ddstoys]

 Hahaha I love mikes work his boards are always top notch.  And once I see a Woz ill make up my own mind like a big boy.  No need to have a cry because mike called your country a name      We call Kiwis sheep shagger we call Brits whining poms Etc

   Harden up fellas ship us the games and let everyone make up there own mind?  Your posts are not helping Jack as others have said its basically more crap we have to filter out yes your may be fact but there's that much bullshit already I don't think anyone actually cares anymore we just want games

   ENJOY PINBALL

[Sunfox]

I explained my stand on amusement machines based on PCs in my last long post. They are hardly "uninformed opinions". I have held this belief for many years and it is well founded based on many years of experience directly with this type of equipment. I have been of this opinion for many years before even hearing of Jack or WOZ. I was happy when JJP announced a new veture and then saddened when I found out it was to be PC based.

You are fully entitled to have a differing opinion and I respect that - it seems that you don't accept that anyone could possibly have an opinion that differs to yours.

By the way - did you know Stern pinballs are made by child labour in Nth Korea and have small bo ..............it must be true you told me.......

I respect that you might have a different opinion. However:

1) When you say something that is provably incorrect - whatever the reason - and then you are corrected in such a way that you see it with your own eyes and it cannot be disputed, I don't expect a reasoned person to blindly ignore that information. It's very hard to have a discussion with someone who thinks the sky is green if he refuses to go outside or look at pictures to see that it's really blue. I don't expect you to take anything I say at face value, but please be open to adjusting your thinking based on empirical evidence.

2) Similarly, if you believe someone is incorrect on something, of if you are trying to present a differing point of view, then most people like to be shown facts or specific pieces of information that help them understand your opinion and your reasons for saying it. To LEARN, rather than be TOLD. For example, elsewhere you say that replacing the motherboard on WOZ will be a "nightmare". Why? How is it much different than replacing a CPU board on an embedded system? Please explain so that I and everyone can understand!

[Retropin]

I see Mike's runs on the board with his contribution to the hobby as heavily outweighing the attacks being made by this JPP person;

Mike has delivered in spades as and when with boards and help - never did see anyone wait several years for a reply with a bunch of LIES about delivery dates in between;

The attitude displayed by this JPP employee and the support by his management leaves me quite happy to stick to my classic embedded controller games, safe in the knowledge that what I can't fix can be fixed by experts like Mike.

So, Mike makes boards, so official Aussie Pinball policy is he's allowed to say anything he wants no matter how false it is? This is a serious question I would like an answer to, and do remember I'm not affiliated with JJP.

If he comes in and says Stern pins are made in North Korea using child labor and include small fragmentation bombs in the power supplies that are all synchronized to explode on January 26, 2014... that's now fact and no one is allowed to dare counter his expertise?

Mate... Mike can say a PC based system is rubbish if he wants. History has them as flaky and he is well and truly allowed to express his opinion to which, members here will evaluate based on their own intelligence.
You and Pinchrome are also well and truly allowed to express completely conflicting opinions, post videos to support etc and again, members here will evaluate.

But... what we don't like on AP is very aggressive and insulting posts... this is not RGP or Pinside or AA for that matter. Any conversations you have had on those forums are on those forums and members here would like them to stay there.
Say what you like but articulate it, not go posting foul language and insults... we don't like it here.. it makes for bad reading and drags the forum down.

  What is the issue here?? Boot times?
Quick search for WOZ boot time on Google brings up conversations on Pinside... Pinchrome has it at about 14 seconds... video has it at 30 seconds... unknown customer has it at 3 minutes ( which could well be an exaggeration and some sarcastic humour thrown in... switch on - go make cup of tea - come back and ready to play... I say the same about GTB 70's EM games... flip the ball, make cup of tea - flip ball again   ).

So what?... Personally, I don't care if it takes 1 minute to boot or 30 secs... if you cant wait a minute to play a game go evaluate yourself not the game.

Will the system stand up over the test of time? - We don't know, the machine will prove itself over the years. This is something that can only be evaluated once machines are delivered and played many times.. something the majority of WOZ buyers ( not owners) are still waiting to do.

Ok.. we have Mikes opinion which we are all aware of... we have yours which we are all aware of... we have Pinchromes which we are also aware of... and there my friend is where all this stalls because without the machines to demonstrate with we are only left with opinions, hearsay and some random videos on Utube...
Personal opinions about a persons machine is what counts and for that... well we now impatiently wait.

There is a massive hold up at JJP - speculation is the PC based system is proving a hassle.. my take is that you are making the boards as you go along... we could all be wrong but without a TRUE and factual statement from JJP we will continue to speculate... Pinchromes rants have done nothing to quell that speculation.

[Sunfox]

If the holdup is in any way related to electronics, then I'd wager it's NOT the PC part!

[pinball god]

Hahaha I love mikes work his boards are always top notch.  And once I see a Woz ill make up my own mind like a big boy.  No need to have a cry because mike called your country a name      We call Kiwis sheep shagger we call Brits whining poms Etc

   Harden up fellas ship us the games and let everyone make up there own mind?  Your posts are not helping Jack as others have said its basically more crap we have to filter out yes your may be fact but there's that much bullshit already I don't think anyone actually cares anymore we just want games

   ENJOY PINBALL

Daniel, I have to stop you there mate. My girlfriend, who is a prize winning sheep, has taken great offence to your comment about new Zealanders. As she is the love of m life, I have to end our friendship here and now.  mods take note of this please, and no one mention anything about chickens either 

[pinnies4me]

 As she is the love of m life, I have to end our friendship here and now.  mods take note of this please, and no one mention anything about chickens either 

Noted, DDS & PG friendship forum approved termination in place.

Now, back to pinball you chicken f*#$ers!!

[pinball god]

 As she is the love of m life, I have to end our friendship here and now.  mods take note of this please, and no one mention anything about chickens either 

Noted, DDS & PG friendship forum approved termination in place.

Now, back to pinball you chicken f*#$ers!!