Bally 1965 Aces High Restoration

[FirePower]

Looks really good and will be an interesting resto to follow.  If I can make one gentle criticism could you use a new fuse holder that is sympathetic to the age of the machine?  If new replacements aren't available could you use new clips on the old bit of the fuse holder maybe?  

[Strangeways]

Looks really good and will be an interesting resto to follow.  If I can make one gentle criticism could you use a new fuse holder that is sympathetic to the age of the machine?  If new replacements aren't available could you use new clips on the old bit of the fuse holder maybe?  

Agreed ! The newer fuse housings will be used only for testing. They belong in sys4-6 etc - not EMs 

[goodolddays]

Looks really good and will be an interesting resto to follow.  If I can make one gentle criticism could you use a new fuse holder that is sympathetic to the age of the machine?  If new replacements aren't available could you use new clips on the old bit of the fuse holder maybe?  

Agreed ! The newer fuse housings will be used only for testing. They belong in sys4-6 etc - not EMs 

Hmmm .. Obviously I am not as purist as some of you , I am putting new fuse holders in my EM's as I restore/reco them. 

[Strangeways]

One step forward, and two steps back.

I replaced the fuse holders and installed new fuses. Recabled the game and checked that the transformer was wired for 240V (more on that later)..

The aim was to test the score motor with the baseboard plugged in on my bench. All I need is 50VAC and one switch on the score motor to be closed and it should turn..

But it was SLUGGISH and CRAP 

Looks like the motor just does not have the grunt anymore. But it measures 6 ohms, so it should be OK ? I jumpered straight off the transformer - still no good. I ended up speaking to Gavin, who suggested I send it off to his Dad in the UK for a rebuild. That was good news - at least I know I CAN get it going.

But I kept thinking that the word "friction" may be playing a part in this. To prove that it was a problem due to excessive friction (even though I had degreased and cleaned the unit), I decided that I HAD to dismantle the gearbox. But to do that, I needed to remove the Cam. It took me a while - But I DID remove it !



Now I'm looking at the shaft which would be attached to the cam and it has some rust. Considering it was siezed to the cam, there could be a chance that the main shaft was also rusted and causing friction.. The only way to find out - was to remove the rivets holding the gearbox together. The drill press made light work of that !




Here's a picture of the gearbox disassembled. Note the casing on the left and the hole where the main shaft (to the cam) is located. There is meant to be a brass collar fitted. Look at the main shaft (center of the picture) - There's THE brass collar ! The collar has effectively siezed tightly on the shaft. It is supposed to allow the rotation of the main shaft - and be FIXED to the casing ! But this gearbox was so badly maintained that the brass collar was not doing it's job. The fact the main shaft WAS rotating, was because the MOVEMENT was the shaft/brass collar against the casing !





Here is a close up of the main shaft and the brass collar after I spent 20 minutes removing it. On the LEFT of the gear, you can see the collar (removed). But look on the shaft - the left side of the gear has signs of rust and pitting.





I cleaned the collar and shaft with degreaser and then alcohol. A green scotchbrite was required to remove the rust and gunk that had built up. I finished with 600 Grit wet/dry on the shaft and also within the collar. I placed the collar over the shaft and it moves perfectly. It is then installed into the reassembled gearbox as a test, and now the motor gearbox works just as it did when it was first built. I've replaced the rivets with longer bolts and screw just as a test, to ensure everything works - so it is only temporary.



Here's the cam installed. I can move the cam with my pinky, and it is very smooth in its operation !



I just need to replace the bolts and refit to the machine.

So there ya go - a full score motor and gearbox rebuild !

 

[ddstoys]

That was great to see Nino each time I have seized score motor I take one look at them rivets and get scared off.  Maybe next time I'll have a gonat rebuilding one.    What bolts do you use to hold it all back together?

[Strangeways]

That was great to see Nino each time I have seized score motor I take one look at them rivets and get scared off.  Maybe next time I'll have a gonat rebuilding one.    What bolts do you use to hold it all back together?

Whatever is lying around in my big box of bolts ! I'm going to have a look if bunnings have something that will suffice.

[Boots]

That was great to see Nino each time I have seized score motor I take one look at them rivets and get scared off.  Maybe next time I'll have a gonat rebuilding one.    What bolts do you use to hold it all back together?

Whatever is lying around in my big box of bolts ! I'm going to have a look if bunnings have something that will suffice.

Looks like the original rivets were brass?
If you want it to look original you could make replacement rivets yourself by getting some brass rod the size of the original rivet .
Make the rivet about 2mm each end longer than the width of the housing and drill a small hole in each end about a mm smaller than the diameter of the shaft.
You can then peen each end with a centre punch (placed in the drilled holes) to roll the rivet out to create a flange.
Once it starts to flare out use a flat ended punch to flatten it out a bit and create a tight join.
Just be careful not to beat the hell out of it as you don't want to split your casing!

[shansta]

So the bearing spun in the casing? Are they plain brass bearings?

If you are going to make one - I would try a self lubricating bush? (Called Sullube from memory)

Much better - bronze with a graphite type lube in-bedded with the steel.

You don't need to lube these things at all...


Like here - http://www.lubroglide.com/

Local bearing shop will have them in all sorts of sizes.

[Mr Pinbologist]

Great job saving that motor Nino
it always scared me the thought of having to rebuild one of these things, i've been real lucky so far and havent had to touch the score motor on any EM i have ever worked on!!

Looking forward to further updates, Will you do anything with the little bit of wear you have just above the flippers?

[goodolddays]

Thanks a lot for sharing that with us Nino . I think, as others have said, seeing your detailed pictures and description will give confidence to anyone faced with a similar problem. I reckon you should add a "Score motor rebuild" thread to the Hint and Tips section so it doesn't get lost over time.

[Strangeways]

So the bearing spun in the casing? Are they plain brass bearings?

If you are going to make one - I would try a self lubricating bush? (Called Sullube from memory)

Much better - bronze with a graphite type lube in-bedded with the steel.

You don't need to lube these things at all...


Like here - http://www.lubroglide.com/

Local bearing shop will have them in all sorts of sizes.

It is a brass collar, just made of tubing. It fills the distance between the top of the casing and the shaft. The collar is supposed to bind to the casing and allow the shaft to rotate. What had happened, was the collar became bound to the shaft, and rotated against the casing. very sluggish. It is not a bearing (as such) but is works like one.

Great job saving that motor Nino
it always scared me the thought of having to rebuild one of these things, i've been real lucky so far and havent had to touch the score motor on any EM i have ever worked on!!

Looking forward to further updates, Will you do anything with the little bit of wear you have just above the flippers?

Not sure yet, Mitch. The rest of the playfield is ok. Any suggestions ?

Thanks a lot for sharing that with us Nino . I think, as others have said, seeing your detailed pictures and de******ion will give confidence to anyone faced with a similar problem. I reckon you should add a "Score motor rebuild" thread to the Hint and Tips section so it doesn't get lost over time.

Once I'm done, I will add more pictures and create a seperate thread 

[FirePower]

Thanks for showing this - as others have said, seeing it detailed out in this way gives others confidence to have a go themselves.

Also to me I really like the way pins combine a few skills; electrics, electronics, mechanical and cosmetic stuff.

Hmmm .. Obviously I am not as purist as some of you , I am putting new fuse holders in my EM's as I restore/reco them. 

Nothing wrong with new fuse holders, desirable I'd say, but just make them match the age and materials of the machine. PBR have an old looking one part number is fus-hldr

[Strangeways]

My challenge was to think of a way to replace the brass rivets. The rivet diameter is 3/16 of an inch, and I had no bolts that were 3/16 and long enough. Using thinner bolts that were of sufficient length was a bad experiment, as the motor coil itself had to be perfectly positioned to enable it's "clutch" to engage. I tried re using the rivets, with a bolt of thinner diameter, fed through the rivet. No good, as the head of the bolt protruded against the motor housing. I found an old motor lying around and something really interesting caught my attention - the cut end of the rivet was threaded and a small bolt was used - not bad - but when I triend it - it was too loose.

Off to bunnings.

Within 5 minutes I found the EXACT bolt that would do the job - and it was BRASS. Cost me $3.20 for four (in a pack). Theses are PERFECT - 3/16 AND countersunk, so that the top of the gearbox housing if flush with it's assembly. Absolutely stoked !

In the picture below, I've fitted two bolts already. I used a washer and did a test run. The alignment was "spot on"





Countersunk head - and the old rivets;





The bottom of the casing ;





Motor and Cam installed. I switched the game on and closed a switch to activate the score motor and it works flawlessly. I had already cleaned and filed all the contacts.





The Big Reward !


I thought I'd be a "smart ass" and drop the baseboard into the machine to test the score motor and get an idea of what my next road block would be. I connected everything to the baseboard and head. Switched the game on and tapped the flipper button. Game switched on - cool ! There were credits up, so I dropped the ball into the ball drain and hit the start button. She sprung to life ! Score reels worked feverishly and finally made it to ZERO for all four players, Ball 1 Light came on and she served the ball ! I tapped the flippers - both worked.. I plunged the ball and she started scoring. In fact - the game was very much playable. There were a few minor issues, like stuck switches and sloppy score reels, but I couldn't care less - you could not wipe the smile off my face. It was like someone had thrown a bucket of cold water over me on a 45 Degree hot day - I was completely relieved and I felt like a kid again !

The more I played it, the less faults were persisting - It was fixing itself ! Try doing that with a DMD ! This game is FOURTY FIVE YEARS OLD - and is 90% in working order. The cobwebs were winding around the steppers in the backbox. This game has not been played for 10 - 20 years. I think I played it for a solid 30 minutes. It is slow and plods along. But it works ;

Here's a picture of the machine in "almost working" condition - playable !



Here's Zac having a couple of games. He is 6 years old and simply loves these games



A VERY rewarding moment for me - yes - took a weekend to rebuild a siezed score motor, but seeing my son playing this game made it all worth it.

This is what Pinball is all about.

[goodolddays]

Top Stuff Nino  Congrats

[Retropin]

far out - aint that cool. My Bingo Bango did exactly the same - sprung into life after sitting since 85 or so. EM's are just bloody magic - ya gotta love em. So pleased for you mate.. i know exactly how you are feeling right now!